183 Dr BDP...How About That Cigar! PCA loosingMoney?

Episode Summary

Episode 183 of A Cigar Hustler's Podcast opens with Mike Palmer catching listeners up on a rough week at home as his wife recovers from her fourth cancer-related surgery, before the hosts pivot to a candid post-mortem on the 2021 PCA Convention & Trade Show. They recap Mike Tsoutsos' guest appearance on the "How About That Cigar" show alongside Chet and Skip, debate whether the reported "record sales" and 48 new accounts claimed by exhibitors like Crowned Heads really reflect a healthy show, and note how thin the exhibitor floor felt with so many mid-size and small brands absent — leaving Padrón, Ashton, Oliva, Fuente, Rocky Patel, Espinosa and Crowned Heads as the anchors. The recurring theme: they don't want to be negative, they just want PCA to survive and work.

The news segment digs into halfwheel's reporting on the PCA's 990 tax filings. The trade group's net loss more than doubled from roughly $386,000 in 2018 to $856,551 in 2019, with revenue up 6.7% to $4.94 million but expenses rising 15.6% to $5.7 million. The hosts break down where PCA's money actually comes from — over 85% of program service revenue is the trade show, with membership dues accounting for essentially all contributions — plus the salaries line item jumping from $727K to $884K, and the legal fees explosion from roughly $32K–$47K a year (2014–2016) to over $1 million in 2017 as FDA litigation ramped up. They also revisit the short-lived Cigar Con consumer-day plan and executive director Scott Pierce's silence on the numbers.

Also covered: Famous Smoke Shop returning online after a REvil ransomware attack that knocked out its website and Pennsylvania retail store for nearly a week (the company declined to pay the $45,000 crypto ransom); Pro Cigar 2022's new February 22–25 schedule in Santiago, with the optional La Romana/Casa de Campo pre-festival leg dropped; Espinosa's new Laranja Reserva Azulejo — an Ecuadorian Sumatra-wrapped, Brazilian Arapiraca-bound, all-Nicaraguan-filler line made at AJ Fernandez's factory in four sizes, shipping late August; and El Septimo hiring longtime Ashton sales executive Chip Golden as director of sales and business development. The episode closes with a signature Florida story about a man arrested for stealing and assaulting an alligator from a mini-golf course, plus UFC banter.

In This Episode

1. 01
   Personal update and life behind the shop
   Mike Palmer shares the exhausting week caring for his wife after her fourth cancer surgery and how it's kept him away from the shop and his cigars.
2. 02
   Recapping the 'How About That Cigar' appearance
   The hosts break down Mike's guest spot on the panel with Chet, Skip and Steven Hippelhauser and who else has been making the rounds on cigar shows.
3. 03
   Was PCA 2021 actually a good show?
   An honest debate about record-sales claims, 48 new accounts, a thin exhibitor floor, and which brands genuinely benefited from the smaller show.
4. 04
   PCA's losses more than doubled in 2019
   A deep dive into the PCA's 990 filings: an $856,551 net loss, $4.94M revenue against $5.7M in expenses, rising salaries, and $1M+ in legal fees.
5. 05
   Famous Smoke Shop ransomware attack
   The retailer went offline for nearly a week after the REvil hacker group demanded $45,000 in crypto — and Famous refused to pay.
6. 06
   Pro Cigar 2022 registration and schedule changes
   The Dominican festival returns February 22–25 in Santiago, dropping the optional La Romana/Casa de Campo leg and Tabacalera de García tour.
7. 07
   Espinosa Laranja Reserva Azulejo
   Details on the third Laranja line — Ecuadorian Sumatra wrapper, Brazilian Arapiraca binder, Nicaraguan filler, made at AJ Fernandez's factory in four sizes.
8. 08
   El Septimo hires Chip Golden
   The longtime Ashton sales executive joins El Septimo Geneva as director of sales and business development.
9. 09
   Florida story of the week
   A Daytona Beach man is arrested after stealing an alligator from a mini-golf course and slamming it on the ground.

Brands & Cigars Discussed

Linked items are in our shop. Mentions without a link aren’t currently stocked or couldn’t be matched with confidence.

Transcript

Welcome to episode 183 of the "Cigar Hustler Podcast". That means we've heard this song almost 183 times. And I don't get tired of it. I love it more every time.

Still the number one show on Podbean. Sorry, Mr. Garofalo. Number 1 Cigar Show.

Number 1. Number 1. Now the monitor's over there. Are you looking at yourself?

I look over there now again. I have to fix that. Well, welcome to episode 183. You too can become part of our podcast family and invest in our show.

Put your products in front of a thousand listeners and viewers every episode. Every episode, we are heard on 12 different podcast providers weekly all around the world. com for more information. Yes.

So I'm very tired. I know you're very tired. So what's going on in your life right now, Mr. Palmer?

Last Friday, my wife had her third reconstruction surgery, but fourth cancer surgery, because she had one where she had other things removed, but it got a lot rougher on her than she anticipated. Yeah, it's a little rougher for you, too. A little rougher. Well, I don't know if it's a COVID thing or not, but the minute she came to in the hospital, it's all right, you're out.

Let's go. We need the bed. You're at the hospital. I'm assuming that's what it is, I don't know, so, but, I mean, I've been the sole caregiver for the last 72, what's more than 72?

73. Since Friday, since Friday, I mean... 96. I mean, very basic information they give you at the hospital, you know, pain pills every four hours, if it leaks, put a new one on, that's really about it.

That sounds about right. There's not too much more to it. Inflammation's inflammation, it's gonna happen. Right.

You know what I mean? There really isn't a lot. But that first night was a little rough, I gotta tell you. Yeah.

It seems like the past 96 hours have been a little rough, Michael. Yeah, the whole thing, yeah. But that first night, I mean, I obviously had been up since 5:00 the morning before, so I mean, I was completely exhausted too. So we get her all situated, she's in a recliner, you guys from here helped me get everything set up and get all my meds and everything I needed.

They all of a sudden go, okay, we've sent the medicine to the pharmacy. Like, okay, it closes at six. It's five something. I'm not going to make it.

Oh, can you call somebody? Like, what? Of course you can call somebody. Well, I can, but what if a normal person doesn't have people like you guys I could call?

They're like, do you have, like, she can't lay flat. Do you have anything she can sit up in? Yeah, but that's in the wrong room. I have large dogs.

Yeah, I mean, this is information that you should have gotten. Yeah, well, see, I was not allowed to go to any pre-- You weren't permitted. Because of the COVID thing. I couldn't go to any of the appointments.

I don't know what they were doing. Man, they really fucked that up. They did. I didn't know what they were doing.

I didn't know what to do. I didn't-- nothing. None of it. None of it.

Nothing. So anyway, so we get her all situated in the chair, you know, get her medicated and everything. And she's like, you know what? You're not gonna make it.

You have to rest or you're not gonna be able to take care of me tomorrow. So go to the other side of the house and lay down because I can't lay in there because of the dogs. Right. So I go to the other side of the house and lay down.

Apparently about four o'clock in the morning, she had to pee and she couldn't reach her phone because of her arms. It was out of reach. Oh my God. Right.

So she is screaming bloody murder. Hank. Right. Yeah.

So I didn't hear a thing. I mean, I was like a baby. So she decided to yell for the dog. Really?

Yeah. So she yelled for Dempsey. Boom. He's got us up, and we're moving.

Dev's like, hey, something's going on. Something's going on. She's calling me now. We gotta go.

Because Dems was in your room. Yeah, he was in there with me. That's awesome. So she's in there crying.

She's about to wet herself. She's been yelling for me for like 20 minutes. Yeah. That was rough.

So now I sleep on the couch, right outside the bedroom door. And her phone is now... She can move her arms some now. Yeah.

But for the first two days, I mean... There was no arm movement. She walked around like you. I mean, it's just, you know...

Oh, like me. Like the Hulk. They got a rash, yeah. Right.

Continual rash. Right. So, I mean, she's doing better. She's on the mend.

The doctor says maybe one more bad day, and then, but, you know, she got to take a shower today, and put on clean clothes, so she feels better. Well, we miss you here, Michael. Thank you. I miss being here.

It's not the same. The file you sent me for the meeting, you can't play it. Oh, yeah? Yeah.

I asked Steve, and he goes, yeah, he sent me one in Texas, too. You can't play those when he sends them to him. So, I don't know if Drew's been faking it all this time. Maybe you need to download the app.

Oh, I could be. Maybe use a different app. The video recorder app? Yeah, maybe.

Because when you go to open it, the attachment, there's no play button. I don't know. Drew's been kind of radio silent with me for the past few weeks, so it's possible that he's not... He's never heard of me then.

He's like, you know what, I bet you if I don't respond or say anything, it's fine. That's right. I didn't do anything wrong, apparently. So much to a point where on Sundays I text him like, "Hey, how are you?

" Oh, when he's up here. Yeah. Is he still even up here? Yeah.

Oh, okay. Do you check and see? Maybe he's not here either. I checked the point of sale.

It says his name. I'm like, okay, he's there. Like, you know, it's, he's like this friend that's currently out of orbit. I don't know.

Yeah, no, we were talking about, cause we, she had a doctor appointment yesterday, so we drove back by, we drove by his house and there's, there's always weird cars there, but they have that food truck thing still parked there, so it could be something involved with that. Right. But we're like, nobody's seen him in mugs. Where is Drew?

Where's Drew? I know, like, summertime's fucked up for me already, you know? Right, yeah. Like, I don't know what came over me, but I committed to a bunch of little vacations.

Because, you know, we never really taken vacations. Right. So I'm like, let's just do this. Now I'm like, holy shit, why the fuck, what was I thinking?

Because for one, I don't know how to vacation. Period. Right. You know, I'm not built that way, for whatever reason.

then for two, you still have all this other stuff with the kids as far as like summer camps and even vacation. If you could unplug. Yeah. Yeah.

So, so that's, that's yeah. So I'm out of orbit and Drew's out of orbit. I say all that just simply state that it's like, where's Drew? Somewhere around here.

So, um, so hi, Drew. We miss you. Yeah. Drew.

If you listen to the show, we don't know if you listen to Vodcast. We miss you. We miss I did the, how about that cigar thing last night? That's right, he did do that last night.

Yeah. I think we'll talk some about that on the Patreon today. Yeah, we can cover some of that there. We can cover some of it here, too.

Yes. Now, I've been, like you say, out of orbit. I didn't even know that a relevant thing happened. I saw the picture.

You really didn't know. I thought you were kidding. No, no, I saw the picture. I remember seeing the picture and I read the thing.

I think I was at the hospital or something when it happened. Really? So, I read a post, but I never saw the interaction that it was a problem. So, your lovely wife explained it to me before you guys got to it, we were texting during the show, as we normally text about your show, and you know, talk back and forth on how well you're doing, or what other people are stupid, or something, critiquing, that's the word, we're always critiquing your performance.

Critiquing. You know, um, well, you're kind of deviating, but I, for me, like when we start talking about PCA and the breakdown and stuff like that, I feel like I don't want to be this like ball of fucking negativity, you know, but somebody has to have, everybody else is like, Oh, it was wonderful. Somebody has to have these real conversations, you know, who's Brian McGee work for? Crownheads.

Crownheads. Yeah. Okay. The lettuce man.

He eats lots of lettuce. Oh, everybody. He's a really good guy. Oh, he said they had record sales.

He can't let it go. He can't let it go. Record sales. Yeah, you know, I would believe that...

And Mickey, whatever, 48,000 new customers or something like that. Who said that? Mickey, uh, Mickey, Mickey, Mickey, Peg, Peg, Peg. 48,000?

I think it was 48, 20, 'cause you guys had asked him on the show last night. Yeah, but he didn't respond. No, no, he did eventually. That's when I gave you the number.

He did later, after you guys asked him the second time. It was 48 total, 22 he was after. 22 targeted is the way you ordered it. So we got 48 new accounts.

48 new accounts. That's good. Was there even 48 different retailers there? There was probably 76.

Oh. Is that the number we're going with? I don't know. That's what Caldwell said.

Oh. 76. 76 retailers at shows. Oh, that's nice.

You know. It's possible. You know, look, Crownheads probably had a good show. I think Espinosa probably had a good show.

Right. Like those are, those are, you know, mid-level cigar companies that were, you know, kind of thrust into the number one spot. You know, you had, as far as big companies, you had obviously Padron, you had Ashton, which looked like a ghost town one time we walked by. Oliva, you know, that was, that was the big guys.

Oh, Fuente, obviously. Rocky. Rocky. so but though you know okay yeah now you know then you so you're missing all these other big guys then you're missing all these mid-level guys and then you're missing the guys that are lower than the mid-level guys you know the smaller boost right there's a lot missing so your competition is kind of light you know and would you have sold to those people anyways it's very possible i mean i mean that west thornton he's a pretty amazing guy just saying I like how he likes to rub his belly now.

He just embraces it. Big ol' belly. He just embraces it, he just rubs it the whole time. My man Wes got the COVID-30, you know, he's got a skinny frame, too, so...

Right, so I mean, that's the only place he put weight on. Yeah. And his hair was longer, but that was it. Yeah.

Yeah. I'm sure we'll be getting some type of explosive device sent to us now from Wes, but it's fine. Oh, poor Wes. Poor Wes.

But yeah, well, and also Crown Heads had four or five new things. Yeah, they had a lot of new stuff, and that's a matter of fact, that's why we're smoking today on the Patreon, if we get that far, the Sarge, Sargent. I'm looking forward to that. Sargent, I knew you were, and so that's why I thought I'd make sure we did this one first.

Let's do this one, yeah. So. Heard good things. Yes.

Heard very good things. Very good, very good things, and so. You can't, you know, you can't, I mean, you can't knock Crown Heads. not crown heads i mean they always you know the one thing they have new things all the time a lot a lot right a lot sometimes it's too much sometimes it's not enough too much stuff i mean what i'm gonna complain when you make too many new things i'm gonna complain when you don't make new things i'm gonna you know like i'm just i just want pca to work i just want it to work right i just want it to be successful everybody has all these great ideas but all these ideas cost money and they They obviously don't have money, because they had to lay everybody off, so, I mean, I mean, the backheaval with the whole consumer day, I wasn't against it, maybe they, maybe the, if that's a way to raise money, maybe their design was flawed, but it, you know, it was a valiant effort, but instantly got squashed, I mean, the pressure, the power, well, you know, it's, it's just an industry thing, we're not letting these commoners come in and just suck cigars from us, I mean, I understand that point.

You know what I mean? But there's gotta be something. Something. Something.

Something's gotta happen. We don't know what it is. I don't, I don't know. Yeah, we're just, I'm just a small retailer, and he's just the owner of the small retailer.

I'm just the owner of the small retailer. He works for me, so, you know. Yeah. It is what it is.

Maybe our friend George, maybe our new friend George from those island landings. Yeah. But, you know, um, yeah, maybe our new friend George. Who the fuck's George?

I'm like, oh yeah, George. He was a memory because we had to be a He did that millennium talk with him, so... " You know, he's like... " I told you, I saw him go back and fill up his styrofoam cup with a bottle after we left.

I believe it. I believe it. He needed every ounce of that. I need more medicine, I had two assholes in here, I need more medicine.

Thank God the little guy left. The little Ronnie Haysha, that guy's just a smooth talker. But how about the cigar? I think it went very well.

I think that man does a very good job running his show. He really does. He does. And the other man and Nicole were very nice.

It was cool to be on kind of a panel, you know, I was also invited to develop the Peloton. Right, I've not watched that one. But they were a little late to the invite, you know, you stick with the commitment. So who was on that one?

I think Abe, Seth, Sokka. Oh, Abe was on that one. Well, you know, when you can't have Cigar Hustler, I mean, who else do you get? You get Abe.

A little bit of a bigger show there, Michael. Yeah, well, you know. I'm interested to see what Abe's take was on the show. If he's, like everybody else, going, "Oh, it was great!

" Yeah, I don't think that he's always that way. It's not that way. So it's very possible that he could have said otherwise. Could have been a little more realistic.

Maybe. Maybe. Maybe. Who knows?

I just don't want to see it. I don't want to see PCA die. No. So who doesn't sponsor How About That Cigar?

I mean, wow. I mean, Drew Estate, Corona, Abe, it was something. Ace Prime. Ace Prime.

Yeah, that's where I turned off. I know. I know. " Oh, yeah.

Well, you did mention Palmer once, somewhere. Oh, when we were talking to George, you said Palmer and I were talking to George. Yeah, it's at least two times you have to get mentioned it twice. Minimum two.

I'll mention it at the end. I'll have to go back and listen to it, yeah. But yeah, it was a good show. But Chet, me, Chet, and Skip were having fun bantering back and forth.

You guys have another, you now have a Curly or a Moe, like a new addition here. Yeah, we do. We have a fourth stooge here with Steven. Steven, which Steven?

Hippelhauser. Oh, well, was he commenting on it? Yeah, yeah. Oh, I saw he had joined the room, but I didn't see you saying anything.

He was saying shit. Chet was having a back and forth with him, too. Oh, wow. Yeah.

It's so weird, because once you get into a thing, you know, like if somebody says something and you reply, you're apparently off the main board and you don't see everything else that's going on. Right. " This is so weird. This is so weird.

" They're all talking. They're all talking. I kept looking down, I kept going to the feed. I kept opening it up and looking at it, you know, trying to like or comment or reply and shit.

It was good, I haven't been on their show in like two years apparently. Yeah, I didn't know it had been that long. Yeah. I remember when you were on it before.

Yeah. Interesting. Wow. We'll have to do like, you know, a whole- What episode number was that they did last night?

116, 118-ish. Wow, they're catching up. No, they're not. They don't do every week, I don't think.

I think they do. And here we are, your wife's, you know, in practically fucking hospice at this point, and we're still doing a- Well, she's not dying. Right, I know. But we're still doing a show.

Right, yeah. I think we're better than David Garofalo. We have almost caught the hot ticket guys. They're at, they're just under 200- $200, I believe.

We will, you will, none of you will ever fucking outwork us. I just want you to know. You may have a more credible show, but you know. Yeah, you may.

You won't have more shows. It's not going to be as entertaining. I'll tell you that. I was watching that last night going, you know, this is very, this is very informative.

These guys, why didn't we watch our show? We don't do any of this. Because we're fun. And we, and we keeps it real.

And real, recognized, real. I did want some drama or something, you know, say something bad about somebody. You needed somebody else. You needed a counterpart, you know, like Smokin' Tobacco, you know, they're...

Very nice. Right. Very nice, very politically correct. I don't want to say the name.

Right, and they, you know, which is totally appropriate. Say the name. Say the name. Well, you know, listen, it's not...

This cigar industry. It isn't like that this is like... I would expect that from them come like year five or year six. A couple of years into the industry, I get it.

Because I was the same way. I was the same way, I think. It's more aggressive now. There we go.

They both said, oh, we had Scott Pierce on the show. I was like, we had Scott Pierce on the show. I was thinking that. I was like, yeah, the guy couldn't, you know, his faxing.

We had him on our show, but he was very busy. Super busy. Super busy. He was almost going to be on today.

Oh, that would have been tough. But I couldn't set that up. This is so last minute. I figured he was drunk somewhere.

I'm kind of curious if Rocky has said anything about the whole, or if he just kind of let it go. " If you're not here, you're not relevant. If you're not here, you're not relevant. Reverend?

I saved the extra one, I put it on your desk, you left it back here. I know. They're both misspelled. I only had one XL.

I didn't have time. I had to go to Jackson's football practice. " Oh. Let's just roll.

It is what it is. Nobody caught it. If you didn't say anything? No one went on.

No one went on. No one went on. Not even Skip. Skip didn't even catch it.

I know. Because, well, your mind, you know, corrects it. Yeah. That's not right.

Right. Well, and the way you sat, you kept, see, like that, it looks like fin ash. You can't even see the E, so maybe they thought the correct spelling was somewhere in there. Right.

Yeah. I noticed you got bored last night and started flexing, making your chest pop and unpop. No, you know what happens with the chair is like my ass starts to hurt. So you pop your chest.

So like I kind of stretch back. Oh, I saw you looking down. And it went boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop. No.

Oh, really? That's just a natural thing for me, apparently, at this point. Oh, sorry. Nice.

Well, there you go. But, you know, I will tell you this. If any show is over an hour, I feel like I need a catheter. Because I had to pee so bad.

Oh, well, watch his name get up and left. I'm like, "Nope, I'm staying. I'm sticking this out. " I'll be right back.

No, I wasn't. I'm not doing it. Did you guys take breaks? Somebody's gonna take a break.

You know what? It's like, if I could survive Bear's whole thing with the stomach bug. Oh, with the poops. " Like, that's just not.

Well, stop chugging that crystal light with that giant glass. Crystal light plus the bang. Right. Yeah.

Got to hydrate. A lot of fluids going in there. I got to hydrate, Michael. But yeah, it was good.

It was a good show. I had fun. I had fun. Who will be on next?

That's the question. Who will be on his show? I got to circle back to Aaron Loomis and be like, let's do something. Let's develop the palates.

We got to come back on. Ah, developing sphincters. Developing sphincters. So that's a way more aggressive show.

Yes. Yes, it is a little harder to describe, I would feel, too. Yeah, I'm getting hints of... But the visuals, though, would be so much fun.

Sometimes, though, you miss my jokes on there, like I was saying, hints of corn, when you were speaking. Yeah, exactly, I didn't hear that. I didn't hear you say hints of corn. I know.

Garrett did. Garrett started dying laughing. You had a little bit of delay on your end. Is there?

Yeah? Yeah. Huh. Interesting.

I'll have to hardwire it next time. Does Greg run the Wi-Fi at your house, too? He does. Oh, there you go.

That's the problem. He built it for me. Oh. It's going to be amazing.

So what's going on here? I mean, nothing really. Yeah, nothing going on here. There's some products coming in, which is fun and exciting.

I got a big package today. Oh, I saw that. You told me as soon as I came in what that was. I have to smoke one of those.

Interesting. Very, very interesting. We have some news to go over, some industry stuff happening. We're at 21, you want to go and break?

I got to do a GoFundMe that I keep forgetting about for Amanda. Amanda. Skip did the post. If you go back to Skip's post like a week ago, he did a post with a kid who has cancer or whatever.

Oh. And yeah, I got to do that. Ah. It's a big deal.

Yes. Keep forgetting. It's a big deal. Yeah.

And I got more football practice. Oh. Lots of football practice. They're going to some kind of national tournament event.

So now it's become a major time suck. What day is it today? Tuesday. Today is Tuesday.

My next break to get out of the house is Thursday evening. Oh, Thursday evening. So what's gonna happen with the shit show? Well, we have banked a couple of episodes in preparation for this.

We have one more 30-minute show that could get us through, if necessary. So you're gonna hit that button? Yes. Released the pre-shit show.

Pre-recorded. Pre-recorded. Yes, Adrian's, uh, appearance was an hour and a half. I heard that was good.

Uh, it's our highest rated show so far. I believe it. It went well. We really tapped into a different demograph there.

People, uh, people enjoyed watching us bicker and argue, apparently. They thought it was very entertaining. It's, it's, you know, it's very, it is very, it can be entertaining. And this was sober, so she was kind.

Oh! She held back. " Ah, let's get her fuckin' lubed up and put her on the show. No, like, isn't Mike, I just light the fire, I'm like, isn't Mike such an asshole?

And then I just walk away, boom, it's like, there goes the fuse, boom, we were sitting here talking, I look over and Chet just checked out, he's just, do do do do, letting us go at it for 15 minutes over here. That's fantastic. Yeah. Heck, and you're doing YouTube on that now too, or no?

Yep, yep, video, audio and video. Is that up on our production page? Uh, it has its own channel. It has it's own.

It's own channel. It's it's own. Yes. Yes.

It does not go up on our show's channel. Very nice. We have two channels now. Our production company has two channels.

It's really expanding. It's becoming quite the empire. Yeah, it really is. Yes.

com. com. That would make more sense. Yes.

Well, at the time, we only had the ones. Yeah. But here we are evolving. Here we are.

Oh, you're evolving. Just hanging out. No, no, it's all, you know. " I'm like, thanks.

Thanks, Brett. Thanks, it's nice of you. Very nice. It's, it's gotta be hard for you to run a retail shop as an owner.

Very, it's very amazing. And handle all this production. Very taxing. Very, very exhausting.

I don't sleep. Successfully run Postana. That's right. What do you think I have a drinking problem?

Handle a wholesale company. " Yeah, your liver is really angry right now. It's probably the way I'm upset to my stomach. Yeah, it thinks that, you know, yeah.

I tried to light a cigar two days ago. I got maybe an inch. Yeah. Then she had to pee again.

Something. " Right. So then later I went back out again and got another inch. " No, it's just not worth it.

You don't get to sit and chill. Right. Yeah, I'm out there hot boxing. You know, just like, this is just ridiculous.

It's no bueno. Nope. No bueno. Nope.

We got craft coming out soon. Oh, that's right. That's exciting. Did they announce who's getting what?

Have they done that? I don't know. I know that I'm getting some though. I can't tell you that much.

I mean, I'm getting some, but it's my shop. I mean, you're getting some. Yeah, I'm sorry. Oh.

You're getting craft. Oh. That was the conversation that I was having when you said, hey, I need to go to the pharmacy. Oh.

Yes. Gotcha. Well, that was nice. I told you in advance this time.

Yes. Yeah. Was there an apology mentioned? Nah.

Well, sorry, you got fucked over last year. That wasn't their fault. We need you to buy a lot of lids because Skip got a new house. Skip got a house with a name.

You got a house with a name. Did it come with a car or the... Does it come with the golf cart? I don't know.

You saw that thing? I heard something Rosales renegotiated and he got some vehicle. He got some vehicle, I don't know if it's a car or the golf cart. He's like, hey, we would like the golf cart.

It's like this, oh, it's like this crazy, it's like the Ford Raptor of golf carts. Exactly. Yeah. Side by side is what they call it.

It's got a turbo. Oh. Nice. Got AC.

Oh. He was talking to me one day and he got, he got, oh, maybe it was on the phone, he got trapped or something in the bay and had to swim back. The high tide. Right.

Yeah. You see him jumping along the rocks like American Ninja Warrior. That was fuckin' amazing. Poor Skip tried to paddle back to the other side.

Yeah. Arlen's yelling from the beach, "Beat that wall! " So, that was amazing. It's good stuff, you know?

Good stuff, good stuff. Alright, let's break and then we'll get to, we'll start the news. We'll get on to the Cigar News. Alright, we'll be right back.

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Welcome back to episode 183 of the Cigar Hustler Podcast. Nice. Look at this arm looks very big here. What, your arm?

No, no, this thing. I've never noticed before how... Oh. I was going to say, your deltoids got to look big from feeding Adrian.

Oh, the feeding, yes, all the feeding. It's the food. From the four corners of the world, all the cigar industry news you could possibly need. The Cigar Hustler Podcast report with Mike Toon.

Thank you. That's something, uh, how about that cigar needs for their La Muerto No. Dios de los Muertos. Yeah, they need a little song, a little music.

Boofing. PCA's losses more than doubled in 2019. The net loss suffered by the Premium Cigar Association more than doubled from 2018 to 2019, increasing from 386,000 in 2018 to 856,551 in 2019. 21 gigawatts, that's a lot of money, so you're saying you're running in the negative, running in the negative, wow, last time I checked, that's a failed business plan, these numbers come from a preview of the PCA's 990 annual tax form from the American Tax Exempt, this has got to be from Charlie, yes, yes, this is all half wheel, yeah, because of its tax exempt nature, these documents are publicly available, ProPublica posted a A preview of the organization's 2019 form, which provides a snapshot of the organization's finances.

75 million in 2018. While this data doesn't show a further breakdown, the PCA's 2018 tax documents showed that more than 85% of the program service revenues were listed as trade show. Ooh. So that's the only place they get money.

That and donations, I'm guessing. I can't believe it. They're not designed for anything else. They sell t-shirts.

Yeah. A bake sale? I went to the PCA and all I got was, the trade show and all I got was a stupid t-shirt. All right, I went to the PCA trade show and all I got was a t-shirt.

" All right. No, you got to pay for it. Yeah. What do you mean?

What do you mean you got to pay for it? What do you pay? And it's 50 bucks. Contributions for 2019 are listed as 727,675, more or less align with the 738,240 generated in 2018.

BCA's 2018 tax documents indicates that 100% of the contributions are membership dues. Oh, that's where they get money from, the dues. The dues. The dues.

Not the don'ts. The dues. The dues. We do.

There's almost nothing in the preview that indicates how the organization spent its money in 2019. The one line item that is revealed is other salaries and wages, which increased from $727,000 in 2018 to $884,000 in 2019. How much? Wait, jump from $127,000 to $880,000?

No, no, no, other salary and wages, which increased from $727,000, $180,000 to $884,000, $826,000 in 2019. Somebody got a raise. Yeah, somebody got, yeah. Scott Pierce, the PCA Executive Director, did not reply to an email seeking comment about this data, including questions about the increase in expenses.

Nothing to say. Don't answer the phone. I don't think that he likes Charlie anyways. Oh, I understand that.

You know what you should say to Charlie? Your wife is in me DMs, hey baby! Give me back on my Jacksonville! We'll be on your laptop party to win my cool baby!

Oh, that's nice. - Wow. What a clip. That's fantastic.

- I wonder where I was gonna work that in. I had it a lot faster than I had planned. - That worked out well. - Your wife is in me DMs.

- Your wife is in me DMs, Charlie! - Man, we were saying that all day after the fight, you know? - Your wife's in me DMs. - In 2019, the PCA rebranded itself from IPCPR to PCA announced a variety of new initiatives which announced plans for Cigar Con, a consumer day, at the 2020 Convention to Trade Show.

The ultimately Cigar Con was cancelled. Two months after it was announced, after negative reaction for both retailers and manufacturers. Oh, let's see. There's a lot more information here.

Do you want to go over this? Yeah, let's go. Come on. 2014-2016, PCA's legal fees line up.

Charlie did all this data. We should share this stuff. Ranged between $32,000 and $47,000. That's their legal fees.

Okay. In those three years, the organization netted profits of $723,960. Wait, this is from 2014. Oh, so for 2014, 2016, they got a profit.

Well, I mean, you should. You should try and, you know. That's a lot of money they get profit. You should try and be in the black.

$723,169, because you need to build a bank, you know what I mean? They were spending less than 1% of its revenue on legal fees. 08 kajillion a million. Wow.

So is that, oh, is that when all the FDA stuff started maybe? I believe it, I believe so. So it's not, so it's legal fees for the organization, not somebody all of a sudden sued the PCA. Right.

Ah, gotcha. PCA's revenue hasn't increased to keep pace with the uptick in legal fees 2017 to 2018. 6% That's a problem. I don't know.

86 million at the end of 2019. What would their assets be? They own a building or something? No.

I don't think so. What would their assets be? Maybe just money in the bank? Is that considered just a net?

Wouldn't that just be money? That's an asset. Wouldn't that be money in the bank though? Asset and then a tangible thing?

A million at the end of 2019. What would their assets be? They own a building or something? No.

I don't think so. What would their assets be? Maybe just money in the bank? Is that considered just an asset?

Wouldn't that just be money? Wouldn't that be money in the bank though? Asset and then a tangible thing? That money is a tangible thing.

I understand that, but like... It's considered an asset. Furniture? Computers?

Plus the computer. The one coffee machine that Scott Pierce has to share with other people? An espresso maker. An espresso.

Neither the full form nor any information about the PCA's 2020 finances have been posted to the IRS's database. Well, I realized, don't put the information out. Well, you're going to have to, but, you know, you wait. You wait to the last minute.

You wait until the deadline is there. That's right. You know, I'm sure they've been a little bit busy putting together the show. Right.

He's one man. I mean, I think they have more people now. I think they brought some people back to the show. Yeah.

So, but now they'll have to lay them off again. You're out of here. Because he's got that raise. He's got that raise.

Thanks for everything. Thanks for everything. Thanks for everything. Appreciate the help.

Yeah. Nice, sweet little old lady trying to get people to eat more. She was very nice. Famous Smoke Shop back online after ransomware attack.

Do you hear about this, Michael? They were held ransom by the Russians. Who's that? Famous?

Famous. They were down when we were at the show. Right. They're back on now.

This is an older story. And very little news other than PCA stuff. After nearly a week offline, Famous Smoke Shop is back online after nearly a week off. After nearly a week offline, Famous Smoke Shop is back online after suffering a ransomware attack.

On July 7th, Famous said it discovered a "detected suspicious activity" within its computer environment. Mmm. That's not good. That's very complicated.

Somebody clicked the wrong link on the email. Oh, the porn. The porn always gets you. Yeah.

Which led to a temporary closure of its website in Eastern Pennsylvania-based retail store. Oh, they even shut down the store. Really? Damn, they lost some money.

" We are not paying you. And... Y'all won't receive me DMs! Hey baby, hit me back with my tragic letter!

You couldn't turn it off. I couldn't turn it off. Famous Smoke Shop was one of more than 1,500 websites attacked over the July 4th holiday by the Russian hacker group REVAL. Revelle, according to the New York Times, Revelle, wanted $45,000 in cryptocurrency to release the data of a single computer system.

That seems rather cheap. Sounds like a lot. I don't know, you figured it would be millions of dollars. $40,000?

$45,000. $45,000 in crypto or $40,000? $45,000 in crypto. Okay, so now you need to determine which crypto, because if they were- Do hackers want like a specific one?

Yeah, let's say they want Bitcoin. Bitcoin's valued at $33,000, $33,000. S. Potentially Compromised.

S. Potentially Compromised. S. Potentially Compromised.

S. Potentially Compromised. S. Potentially Compromised.

S. Potentially Compromised. S. Potentially Compromised.

S. Potentially Compromised. S. Potentially Compromised.

S. Potentially Compromised. S. Potentially Compromised.

S. Potentially Compromised. He's going to get attention-based cyber techs like those from Ravel as soon as he figured out what the internet was. Sorry, I just threw that in and he didn't say that.

Yeah, you know, that's how you know these hackers are disconnected. Because the real move here, where the real money is, is you go to Famous, you shut them down and say, "We have all these scrambled, we're gonna want," you know, you could save $40,000 to turn it back on, but we want another million dollars to not tell the spouses of all of these cigar smokers how much money they fucking spend on cigars. And then they'll be like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Whoa, whoa, hold on now.

Stop it. Please don't do that. We're going to release the actual shopping list, 5% and dollar amount. Yeah, and we're going to send it to their wives.

Famous Smoke Shop is one of the largest cigar retailers in the world, and they still only hit them for $45,000. They didn't know. They didn't know. You'd think the hackers would be a little more.

And they didn't get that either, though. I don't know what you're going to get it for. Retailers in the world know Primely Ford's extensive online and catalog sales. It's in the largest independent retailer, meaning it is not owned by a company and also produces its own cigars in the USA.

It do. So, excuse me. So, they got turned back on, apparently, and they didn't pay it. It took over a week.

So, it cost them. It cost them. How much they lost in revenue? I don't know.

What do you think they do? I think it was PayPal. It could have been PayPal. It was PayPal.

I mean, what do you think they do? 30,000, 40,000 a day? Easy, easy. That's what I mean.

It's one day sales. It's one day sales. They lost seven. They would ask for more.

" Oh, it's like the introductory thing. It's like when they steal your credit card and they run it for 99. Right. Oh, wait, it worked for 99.

Okay, now go 299. Right. You know, it's like when you told them the story about the guy with the dick pics. Oh, yeah, right.

Yeah, you send them the money, they want to send more money. Oh, now I need more money. Oh, this is working. This is working.

Success. Success. We found one. Sucker.

Federal Appeal Court. Oh, we were going to skip this because it was very long. Pro Cigar 2022 announces new schedule open for registration. Pro Cigar.

Pro Cigar 2022 is now open for registration, meaning those who wish to attend the Dominican Republic Cigar Festival can secure their spot. This is not just the video one. We will be there. I don't know.

We got a COVID spike here everywhere. After canceling this year's event due to the coronavirus pandemic, Pro Cigar will return February 22nd to the 25th, The 25th, and Santiago de los Caballeros, the heart of the Dominican cigar industry. Let's see how this plays out. However, the event will be changing in 2022 for some of the festival's participants.

For Pro Cigar 2022, the organization has dropped the optional visit to La Roma that precedes the main part of the festival that takes place in Santiago. Typically, this portion of the event is taking place at Casa de Campo, a resort from Sunday through Tuesday. It is done so people can see Tabla Calera de Garcia, the world's largest cigar factory, which is located in lovely La Roma on the far eastern side of the island, where you can see Skip's house now from there. Skip bought the factory because it came with a golf cart.

But he bought the island across from the way. Instead, the event will now simply kick off a Tuesday, starting with registration and a cocktail hour for the next two days. Guests tour fields and facilities, learn about cigar blending and the production process and have the opportunity to meet and mingle with manufacturers. Evenings consist of dinners held throughout the city, it sounds like you're winning something like on a game show, but wait, there's more, but wait, there's more, act now, you're gonna get two, evenings consist of dinners held throughout the city, including one known as the white party, yep, the, not what it sounds like, it's not a racist thing, no, everybody wears white, everybody wears white, yeah, black people can go to, yeah, yeah, it's true, yes, that's stupid, monumento a los heroes de la resurrección, a central monument in the city, oh, let's see, so that's the monument for the heroes of the The Festival will wrap up with a Members Field Day, a concept introduced in 2019, and then with a gala dinner featuring an auction of art and cigars, many coming in unique humidors made just for the event, Members Field Day.

Is that like a sack race? It's a gigantic twister game. Sack race? Right hand red.

Carlito's there, yeah. Pepin? No, uh, Carlito and Pepin. He's in Nicaragua.

Well, maybe he goes for this. I would say that Carlito's probably there for the break dance. Fred Rui will be there. Fred Rui goes.

Yeah, Fred Rui. He goes everything there. He's the busiest guy not in the industry. Well, apparently he might be allegedly in the industry.

Oh, he might be. We should try to get him on the show to release the... Reveal. We're not a real show.

Reveal. Yeah. Fake stuff. Fred, what are you doing?

You can tell us. We don't have any listeners. Go ahead. No one else is going on.

Let's call him on the phone. Hey, Fred. You're not on the podcast, so tell us. Yeah, I just want to know what it is.

Wait, can you say it again? We forgot to hit record. Louder. Espinosa La Ranja Reserva Azuelo.

Azuelo. Azuelo. Azuelo. Azuelo.

Azuelo. Azuelo. Debuting at the PCA 2021. Now, this is one of the few cigars I have smoked from the show, and it was very good.

It was very good. It was very good. It was very good. I evidently had a couple of those.

This must have been the one that he kept going, go away. Here, take this. Take this and go away. We can be bought.

We will stand here until you give us more stuff. More cigars. Go away, shh, go away. Just please, please.

Espinosa Premium Cigars is adding a new member to its La Ranja lineup, the Reserva Azuelo. It becomes the third member of the La Ranja series, which debuted in 2014, and added the La Ranja Reserva Escuro in 2019. The cigar uses a dark Ecuadorian, I hear it's going to be the 2022 Cigar Snob Cigar of the Year. Oh, you did?

I heard that. Really? Allegedly? I heard that.

You know what he always says? I heard that. I heard about that. I heard about that.

I heard about that. I heard about that. Yeah, I heard about that. The cigar uses the dark Ecuadorian Sumatra wrapper.

It is very dark. It's delicious. It's delicious. A Brazilian Aparaga binder, Aparaga.

End of the bang. And fillers that come... I'm not banging you. This is weird.

I haven't been going that long. I know you miss me, but come on. Yeah, but you're fatigued too, so it wouldn't be fun. It would not be fun.

It would be no fight. Yeah. Let's see, in fillers that come from all the Nicaraguan's growing regions, according to the company, this is a special, oh whose voice would it be, oh it's Eric, bro, this is a special cigar, I believe it's the perfect blend to join the La Ranja family, said Eric Espinosa in a press release, I can wait for our retailers to try it, the original La Ranja and the La Ranja Oscuro have done incredibly well for us, I'm looking forward to the Azuelo launch, it's hard to do, well the original La Ranja got its name from the Portuguese word for orange, and was a nod to both the color of the cigar's Brazilian-grown Rapper and Cigar's color scheme. Is the wrapper an orange?

I didn't know some of them. Oh, maybe. Hmm. The name of Spelo originates from Portuguese word for a bluish-glazed colored tile.

Yes. They gave us the sticker. Oh, is that what that was? Yeah, he's like, here, this is the...

Oh, I wonder what that was. Like, what? Like, I don't need it. Like, how did that get in my back?

Thanks for the coaster. That way... I didn't know what it was. Oh, where'd I pick up tile?

How'd that happen? I'm gonna put this on my bathroom floor. The floor. Hey, can I have 700 more of these?

So I can put them all on my floor? The Espadoza Laranja Reserve Azuelo is being launched in four sizes. It's a Corona Gorda, a Robusto, Russo Grande, Toro, and a Gordo. J.

Fernandez and Lutano Factory in Nicaragua. It'll begin shipping to retailers in late August. And we met AJ, as we mentioned, he's a very nice man, first time I ever met him. Very nice.

Very nice. You think he'd be Tanner, sitting, very pale. He's always in the factory yelling at people, making sure that everybody does everything right. Kind of like you here.

Oh. Yeah. Kind of. Yeah, just coming down on everybody, as an owner.

As an owner, yes. Yeah. Very successful. Oh, shit, I just spilled everything.

El Septimo names Chip Goldstein, Director of Sales and Business. Ooh, Chip, El Septimo, so they had a big booth. They had a big booth, they won a big, medium-sized booth of the year or something. They had the best booth with television.

But I don't remember seeing this gentleman there. Chip. I don't remember seeing Chip. He might have been there.

He would have kind of stood out, I think. Yeah. The 2020 on PCA Convention Trade Show prepares to kick off. El Septimo has announced that it's new director of sales and business development, and it's Chip Golden.

Golden is best known for more than two decades with Ashton Cigars spending a good amount of time in the company's VIP of sales. That explains why there's nobody to Ashton. He's not with them. Oh, he left.

He left. Yeah. Because El Septimo was just very busy over there. Hmm.

It looked like a bar in Vegas, their thing did. What's up? What's up? Walk around the club.

Flashing lights and big screen TV at the top. They were pretty girls, Elsa Timo. We are excited to add to our natural growth with the addition of Chip to the Elsa Timo senior management team, said Zia S. Yunnan.

I think that's who we met. We met that guy? Yeah, I think we met that guy. Chairman and CEO of Yunnan Company in Elsa Timo, Geneva, Via Presley's.

Ooh, somebody took us over there and introduced us. Who was that? Yeah, Marto. That's right.

Gerard. Gerard, that's right. S. and Pacific Rim region.

Golden's hiring is effective immediately, and he will join the company in its booth at the trade show. Hmm, didn't see him. Maybe he was at lunch. Could have been.

Over there with that old lady. Hello. Hello. What are you eating?

You should eat more. We have a lot of food over here. We have one bus and no one's coming by. I'm excited to join Elsa Timo, Geneva, and to be part of a worldwide luxury brand.

I have no idea what his voice is. S. market. Once I just wanted to hear somebody say, "I'm a little happy maybe about going.

" Everybody's always thrilled, and then six months from now he's working somewhere else. You know, here's what the best news description would be. Like, "Hey, listen, we know it's a really saturated market, but we're going to go for it anyways. " You know, like, okay, cool.

Right. Sweet. Yeah, they were, last night on How About That Cigar, they were both mentioning some company that has one cigar, one blend, one size. Ooh, that's going to be tough.

Yep, but we're going for it. I like that guy. And we have a booth. I like this man.

Oh, yeah, what do you got? Just this one. Try this one. Try this one.

Oh, really? How many you got? Just the one. Yeah, the one thing.

Matter of fact, can you just take a puff and then pass it to the next guy? We really only have the one. We really need this to be shared. All right, quickly, Florida story, we're running out of time.

Yes, quickly. Daytona Beach officers observed William Bubba Hodge carrying an alligator down A1A last week. Hodge was arrested after he was seen trying to throw the alligator onto the roof of a business and slamming it on the ground by its tail. Oh, throw it on the roof.

He was trying to kill it. Hodge was charged with five offenses, including the felonies of animal cruelty, possession and injury of an alligator, and burglary. So apparently he's trying to use it to break into it someplace. Ah.

The alligator was returned to management of Congo River Gulf. Oh, he stole it from the Congo River. It's not even a dangerous alligator. That's fucked up.

That's a hand-fed alligator. He stole that alligator. He stole the alligator. It wasn't even a natural alligator.

He's trying to rob somebody, and then I'm just going to kill it. The golf kids are very upset. Congo River Gulf from where Hodge claimed to have stolen it after a brief wrestling match. Oh, he had to fight.

Oh, a brief wrestling match. It was a good three, four footer in the photo. It was a good size alligator. He did a good job, taped up, I'm sure he taped it up in his mouth and didn't look like it, oh he's dragging it around with his mouth open?

Yeah, by the tail, he was slamming it on the ground with the tail of it. Okay, gotta love Florida, you know what's funny is the Dio De Los Muertos, I thought for sure they were gonna say something about Florida, they're like 12 deaths and I was like, it can't be Florida. If we're doing it, we're at least in the triple digits for death. Yeah, that's 12.

I just want to know, boofing was a thing down here. It's in a thousand. We do it here, we just don't die. I believe, I believe that the numbers...

You think that doesn't go on at the University of Florida and... You think the kids at Boston U are dumber than the kids in Florida? Oh, yeah. Really?

Yeah, they grew up here making meth and stuff down here, so... Yeah, like, "Oh, boofing? " Oh, okay, okay. That's initiation, get into the drilling drill.

Yeah, we don't even use the vodka, we use the fucking moonshine. The Everclear. Yeah. Just quartered up my ass with a syringe.

My great, great, great, great, great granddaddy made this recipe for boofy. And we boofed the shit out of it. All right, this is, uh, we don't have a Listener of the Week. Do you have a Listener of the Week?

I don't have a Listener of the Week. You are all Listener of the Week. Thank you, America. Congratulations.

I can probably figure out a Listener of the Week if I wanted to. It wouldn't take long. We don't have that much time. All right, we'll let it go.

We will let it ride. All right, this has been... What about Douglas Pendleton? Douglas Pendleton.

I don't know who is Douglas Pendleton. He's asking about you in my DMs. He's in my DMs. Your wife is in me DMs, hey, baby.

Your wife is in me DMs, hey, baby. Yep. I want you to know if I was okay? Well, I wasn't on the show last night.

What? What did he ask about me? He wants to know if you'll be here tomorrow. Oh, no.

All right, uh, we're here. No. Oh, no. No, no in Thursday night.

Next time I'll be available. Your wife is in me DMs. Your wife is in me DMs. We're going to a party at the wind, baby.

Like, I can't believe Conor McGregor caught shit because it'd be like, no class. I'm like, what? Dude, you want to fucking, that's this, if you think that it's just a physical game, you're out of your mind. You want to fucking, you want to own that guy.

You want that guy to think when he walks in, this guy's gonna kick my ass, and he was doing that. He was definitely doing that. Oh, you think he was winning? I think that he was mentally fucking with Poirier.

Oh, yeah, mentally, but, you know, I don't think that- I don't, I mean, round one was kind of tight, you know, he went down, the kind of takedown at the end was one thing, but- Well, once the ankle broke, and then he was, I mean, but you can't count that. Yeah, but what's amazing about UFC is, you're just one fucking missed punch away from getting knocked the hell out, and then it'd be in a wreck. Oh, as we saw in all the other cards for the night. Yeah, like, I mean, I watched last night's, last Saturday's card, and this guy was getting, this guy was getting his ass kicked, I'm like, oh my god, this guy is just getting tooled.

And come round three, he goes in, bing, knocks the guy out, and I'm like, oh, that's over, so much is the other guy gonna win. Oh, the other guy got a little cocky. Yeah, he's like, oh, this is you. I'm winning, I'm winning, I'm winning, I'm winning.

Oh, shit. I mean, that's what happened with Greg, Greg Hardy and Ty to la la la. Oh, la la la la. Yeah, the guy drinks out of the shoe.

Oh. Yeah, you saw that fight, right? So Greg Hardy had him on, he pinged him. Right.

And Ty took a wobble back, Greg Hardy got a little overzealous, no mistake, and you're done. And now he's drinking out of your shoe. And now it's my shoe. And I'm going to drink from it.

That's gross. That guy was drinking out of everybody. I love that guy. I wish we would have ran into him.

Drink out of me shoe! That guy was drinking out of so many shoes that night. Ugh. Just random shoes.

He's got a hand for what? Foot-mouth disease. All sorts of things. I'm going to tell you right now, that guy, he is the antibody to COVID, without question.

Ugh. All right. Thank you guys for listening. We will be back next week.

Mm-hmm. Talk to you later, bye. These broadcasts are presented and made public as entertainment, in the hope that they will be entertaining to the audience. This has been a Cigar Hustlers Podcast, a Mike and Mike production.

Be sure to listen every Tuesday at 10am for all new episodes. - Hi, I'm doing, I'm Who's Sto-E-Raw. - Yeah, we just don't have to do a single, uh, single podcast ever again. - Perfect.

- Perfect. - I'm good, Mike and Mike. How are you guys doing? - The Hojo Deer.

- Hojo! It's the Hojo! - Demandre, you let him fuck it up all the way. - I can get past Hojo!

- I don't even have to try it. - I'm gonna try it. - We're gonna cover a lot of ground here, Mike. - All right.

Try to keep up. - That's a sign of a good podcast. It's a good podcast right now. It'd be like four cigars when I walked in a door.

All right, end this.

Show Notes

This week we get caught up on Dr BDP and his wife's condition...Mikey's second appearance on HBTC and why is PCA loosing money but salaries increase?