Cigar Hustler Special Episode Erik Espinosa
Transcript
1234 We are officially here with
the Alpha dog himself, our dear
friend Eric Espinoza.
What's up, man?
They.
They got to clap a little louder
than that boy.
I paid.
I paid my dues.
You know it's got to go live.
You think so.
You think you you think you paid
your dues.
I have.
Yeah, I think you.
I think you have.
I I think you most definitely
have. 24 years doing this man.
I think I have.
And we've been friends for a
little while now.
We have, we have.
And man, you know, you've always
been a a mentor for me and in
many ways and I really
appreciate that you've always
given it to me straight.
And this is going to be one of
those interviews where it's two
friends kind of talking and
we're not going to talk about
your normal bullshit that you
normally talk about.
So, but before we get into some
of the detail about things, I do
want to cover briefly that you
just had Liz Onapalooza.
How did that go, 'cause you
looked a little stressed, a
little, you know, you, you had
some, some shit going on.
Yeah, I mean, look, it's, you
have about 250 people in your
home.
That's the way I say it.
It's in the warehouse.
It's not at my house, but that's
a home away from home.
And you want everything to come
out, right?
You know, you try feeding 250
people, you try having 250
people with a lot of libation in
the place, you know, and not
have any issues, you know?
Yeah, you know, I, I got to make
sure everything's OK 'cause
here's the thing that I tell
everybody, we have our rules
down there, right?
And and they're very simple.
Aim the mic a little bit more
towards you and just say no you
can.
There you go, that works.
Too.
They're they're very simple
rules.
There you go.
You can drink all you want as
long as you don't bother nobody.
Because the problem is that
people take vacation time.
They take that week off just to
go to Lisona Palooza.
And, and, you know, and they pay
their airfare and they, they pay
for the their stay.
And I want them enjoy
themselves.
You know, we don't talk about
race, religion, politics and all
that.
And I want everybody to meet
everybody.
You know, if you have too much
to drink, you got to go.
You can come the next day, but
when you start bothering
somebody, I have an issue with
that because again, I don't know
the stress level or the
financial of of, you know, of
getting there what everybody
has.
So I would just want everybody
to enjoy themselves, have a good
time and listen, are there were
there any issues?
Minors, minor bullshit like
always, But but for the most it,
it was incredible.
We had Guy Fieri there, you
know, did it in Q&A's.
And then we had a little
surprise.
We had the lead singer of
Godsmack there, Sully.
Sully was in.
Here, you know, it's funny.
I've never heard a song I don't
like.
I don't understand.
I'm not into heavy metal.
How?
Have you not heard this dude?
Because.
I when I grew up, I was big into
Rush.
I like as far as heavy metal I
would ever go with probably Led
Zeppelin.
I was a big fan of Lynyrd
Skynyrd.
It's still like seventies, 80s.
You know.
You never kept up with music.
I mean, what happened?
To you if I know the the 8
tracks came out.
And that was the end of it.
Of you, huh?
Yeah.
Yeah, and then the the CDs and
then, you know, the tapes and
all that.
You know, I when I was a
traveling salesman, I got into a
book on audio.
Audiobook.
I so I.
That doesn't surprise me with
you, I.
You know, I I would read a lot
of book.
I read probably all of Dan
Brown's book, Da Vinci Code.
Gotcha.
And all those and then John
Grisham was was a good one if I
remember.
So I I would buy them and and
just listen.
Now I just listen to a lot of
sports radio.
Gotcha.
So all fiction books, no
personal development things,
none of that stuff, huh?
No, because no Tony Robbins kit
back in the day.
I don't need anybody to motivate
me.
Yeah, I, I really don't I, I,
you know, I like, everyone's
different, you know, everyone
has a different style and, and
how they sell and I, I don't, I
really don't need.
I wake up in the morning and I
when I'm home, I go to the gym
and, and I have a power shake
when I'm done and I'm ready to
go, I'm ready to roll.
I'm I.
Just you're ready to.
Go.
I'm made different, I guess.
I don't know.
I don't.
Yeah, I think that you.
Are I don't need nothing or
anybody to motivate me.
You know, if you find me
somebody who likes to lose, I'll
show you a loser.
I don't like to lose in
anything.
I know you and I got to talk
about that.
Speaking of that, we could talk
about I was going to lead into
that, I was going to lead into
that if you want so.
You know, I, I really don't, I
don't, you know, listen, I'm,
I'm off for everybody being
successful and I really don't,
you know, and, and I do listen
to people.
But here, here's the difference.
You can be successful at what
you do, but they don't know shit
about the cigar world.
You know, there's no different
than I told guy.
I told him no, you know, since
we're on that subject and and he
asked me why not because just
because it's it's called knuckle
sandwich or guy Fiat, he doesn't
mean he's going to sell right,
unless you do something about
it.
And he has, you know, so, you
know, and and I don't care what
I don't want any outside advice
and telling me how to run my
business.
Now, sure, I can get advice on
financial and you know, and
advertising and all that.
Yes, but as far as selling
cigars?
No.
Well, I mean that's what you do.
You've done it for 100 years.
But there is definitely some,
some, some part of an alliance
there with you and Guy as far as
looking to develop and grow a
vision, right?
So you know, he knows that he
aligned with you because you're
good at what you do, right?
You're good at sales, you're
good, you're good at marketing,
you're good at creating cigars,
all of those things.
Right now he has that whole
other aspect, that whole 4
quadrant thing, the yadda yadda.
And you know, I don't even know
it was called fucking triple D
until somebody dropped it at at
AI think Jack goes, oh, a little
triple D.
And what the hell is that?
You never seen the show?
No, I have, but I didn't, you
know, I didn't know the cool
slogan logo that you guys call
it or whatever the hell, you
know, like I.
Really thought he was one of the
Backstreet Boys.
I swear to God.
You know, before I met him
because he it looks a little
bit.
I hope he's not listening to the
show but I've all clipped.
That so and I'll tag.
No, no, yeah, no, dude, I
really, I really didn't, you
know, I didn't know anything
about him.
I knew about the show and, and I
would follow him because I have
the app right before we were met
and all that.
I didn't know anything about
him, you know, But I liked what
he told me, you know, and, and I
did a little bit of research
and, and then the first time we
met, the second time we met, I
was talking to Sammy Hagar.
I'm not dropping names, I really
don't care.
But they have a tequila company
together.
And Sammy shook my hand and
looked me in the eye and told me
that that'll be that's the best
business partner you'll ever
have in your life.
I believe that.
And he told me this guy's a
non-stop.
He's a non-stop working.
His work ethic is better than
mine.
She told me he's promoting,
promoting, promoting.
And he gets mad like we're in
the Food and Wine festival in
Miami.
And we went, you know, you got
to dress up a little bit.
I dressed up a little bit and
he's ready to call me on stage.
He looks at me, goes, where's
your fucking shirt, the knuckle
sandwich shirt?
And I'm like, dude, I didn't
know you're going to call me on
stage.
He's like I said, I got an idea.
Hold on.
There's a good friend of his
that I gave a shirt to and he
wore the shirt.
And I say, come here, bro.
We switched before I got on
stage.
That's awesome.
All right.
So I want to get into some other
things.
One thing that you, you know,
we've always had back and forth
conversations throughout my
journey in this industry and I'm
grateful for all of it because
you definitely have an honest
perspective of things right now.
One thing that I always hear you
say is somebody's getting into
these cigar industry.
You say, hey, don't do it, don't
do it, don't do it, don't do it
now.
So then why the hell did you get
into the cigar industry?
Like why did you you were you
started off just to briefly
surmise Drew Estate, Rocket
Patel whole thing.
I mean, your big deal, right?
And then you decide to go into
your own brand and at that time,
did you know what it was going
to take or did you just or were
you also kind of like, you know,
blind into it?
You know what I mean?
No.
Here's the difference.
I had the connections right
because I had already done.
I already read for other people
and I knew a lot of the stores.
Yeah, you're the guy who come
in.
You played the dominoes and
people would have to buy the
assets.
Yes, correct.
Or whatever.
However, that worked.
And I knew every single shop in
Florida.
Right.
I was just telling somebody I I
used to come here before you
guys owned this.
Yeah, I remember they had a a
bird called Arturo.
They had a bird.
They had a parrot.
You know what's funny is there's
there was like a two or
three-year lull where there was
nothing here.
Really.
Yeah.
We had no idea it was.
A cigar store so I have a lease.
I had the whole state of Florida
covered.
Now when I had AI did it with a
business partner was Eddie, and
he knew a lot of the other
people in the states, the big
accounts and all that.
So I have a huge advantage.
So when somebody approaches me
and I tell them, who are you
going to sell it to?
Let's stop and think about this.
Yeah, you, you have your own
brand, right?
And you're successful in your
brand, but it but it but it took
you a long fucking time.
I mean, it's been 10 years of
abuse and it's nowhere near
where they need your cigar.
Store needs your cigar, right?
Like they need a hole in their
head.
No different than mine, right?
OK, they don't need anybody's
cigar, right?
OK, maybe fat bottom better you
now or whatever, but it's the
truth.
If they don't come in, if they
come ask you for my cigar,
you're going to tell them,
listen, we have this, you know,
so I don't think they need
anybody cigars.
Now, how do you sell cigars?
A They got to be good.
But but mostly all the cigars
out there are good.
Yeah, I don't.
A high percentage of them, OK.
OK, I'll give you that.
Right.
Now I'll just agree.
To OK a high percentage of them
but why are people going to buy
your cigars?
The retailers right because of
you ain't got shit to do about
the cigar bro.
Sure, it's because of you the
relationships you build, right?
OK, now getting it in the store
is easy right?
The reorders where becomes a
problem. 100% now.
You're doing something.
You have this podcast.
Yeah.
You, you ship you, you know, you
have a mail order, you have your
own retail shop.
So you have a huge advantage.
Other than Joe Blow, who hangs
out in the cigar shop in Wyoming
and don't know, don't know
fucking person in the industry
and they think they're going to,
you know, they're good.
And I tell everybody I can make
you the best cigar in the world,
that it don't fucking matter,
even with money.
Let's stop and think about what
I'm mentioning names here.
All right?
Just I want you to reminisce a
little.
Bit sure there's.
People here in the industry now
that I've tried for 3-4 years
who got AI, wish I had a nickel
for everybody actually.
Like they got money and they're
fucking flat broke.
But.
Especially in this industry.
Yeah, you reminisce a little
bit.
There's two or three guys out
there.
They're fucking tycoons
according to them, right?
They're not successful.
No, not even close.
And that's my point.
You can have, you can have fuck
you money and it don't mean
you're going to make it.
People smoke cigars from people
who they like.
That's true.
Because if I come in here, which
we have the event tonight, by
the way, we're running some
specials and you can get a
lighter, but I know this don't.
It's going to happen next week
anyways.
So anyway, you know, and I
become an asshole to somebody
or, you know, they're never
going to smoke my cigar again.
I don't give a fuck how good the
cigar is, right?
You know, it's the little things
that matter, you know, the the
impact you have on people and,
and at least they'll give you a
shot.
And that's all I ask for
somebody to give you a shot.
And getting back to what you
asked me, these, these people
have no connection.
They have no, I think the only
way you can make it work, you
got to be great in social media
and sell it to the consumers,
right, Because the shops, it
ain't going to work.
I think it's too late in the
game.
But but to bring it kind of
back, so you felt that because
you had those connections, you
could build a brand.
And I was forced, you're forced.
I was forced to do this because
I one time I won salesman of the
year with one of the companies
and then I got a a bonus check
for 20 grand and a pink slip the
same day.
See you later.
And I said, how the fuck you
fire the guy who made you the
most amount of money and it
didn't matter.
So and then you know, you guys
know my story.
Then that same day I called my
son and I was still repping for,
I still have Jewish state in
Rocky at the time.
And I told my son, listen, what
are you taking to college?
You know, because to me college
is overrated.
Dude, I had to get through.
Yeah, I think knowledge is
power, don't get me wrong.
But I think a lot of people go
to college and never do.
What the fuck?
No, I mean, you got to have a
vision if you're going.
Yes, and you got to like it.
You got to like what you do, be
love what you do for a living.
You never work a daily life, but
it so you know, and I said,
look, can you take that shit
online or whatever?
You know, I'm not a tech guy, so
I really don't know about those
things.
And he said yeah, Dad, I can't.
I said, all right, well, why
don't you, you know, I need your
help.
And now at that point I got
screwed by several people and,
and I said to myself, I'm never
going to have another business
partner because I tell everybody
there's a ship that's guaranteed
to sink all the time.
And that's called the
partnership.
And I said to myself, never
again would I have a partner in,
in any business.
So I said, I have this vision.
There was some dark times, man,
Dark days.
I mean I had to buy my cigars
back from my wholesaler who
bought them all and pay the
wholesale price on them to sell
it to the stores at the
wholesale price.
Oh my God.
Because I didn't have a factory,
I didn't have nobody to make the
cigars for me.
It was fucking horrible.
Wow man, that is absolutely
incredible.
Oh yeah dude it was and and and
I had to pay for the shipping
from where they were at when I
mentioned the name to get it
here than to than to I was
losing my ass.
I.
I think the first time that we
met, I just, I had popped into
like a smoking or some shit and
you were doing the Obama had
just launched.
It was brand new.
I said, oh, I got a cigar store
up in Deltona or whatever.
He said, oh, hey, take down my
number, whatever, we'll be in
touch.
And then that was kind of the
beginning of it.
So you were out humping it and
just putting in the work as soon
as your brand started, you know,
but now you kind of Fast
forward, you have some people
under your own corporation.
You still have some brokers and
stuff like that, right?
I mean, you got look, Tyler, I
love, right?
Richie's amazing, Jack's
amazing.
Heck, you got you have some
fucking solid.
I got some shoulders, man.
In your crew.
I, you know, I'm a huge military
guy, even though I wasn't even
born in this country, but I, I
support our, our military.
And I think they're so
structured, you know what I'm
saying?
You tell them at 7:00 and
they're there at 6:50, right?
You know, and I look, some of
these times I like to get home
when I'm done.
So I get the earliest flight
out.
I don't care if it's 4:00 in the
morning, right?
And it's a just leave me in a
hotel close to the airport.
I'll over to the No, no, no, no,
no, no.
There's no way you're taking an
Uber.
I'll take you.
No different than Tyler, Gavin,
Josh.
These guys would tell me no,
I'll get up, I'll be up and
they're and I'll be damned if
they're not up before me.
They're knocking on my door.
Hey, let's go.
Let's go.
Yeah, dude.
And then they get and then they
get they go home or whatever.
You know, we're at the same
hotel.
Whatever.
And but I like shoulders.
I like people that and I
compensate them.
I, you know, I, I take care of
my people.
They don't, you know, Yeah, I
believe that because I haven't
heard an I'll word about anybody
who's worked under your business
with your actual corporation,
right.
Like these guys think the world
of you, you know, and that's
kind of that's got to be good to
hear.
They look.
Because I'll tell you right now,
Jack was talking shit, I tell
you.
Listen, they stay where I stay.
You know how expensive the trade
show can be.
Oh my God, yeah.
But wherever the trade show, the
host, whatever hotel, they're
staying there and, and
everybody's got their room.
And I'm not putting them across
the street on a $59 hotel.
Shit.
I get, I pay a lot of money for
the padding, just for the
padding at the, at the at our
booth you're on, you're on your
feet the whole time there.
And you have to be comfortable,
you know, and and you know, I
take care of them and we don't
need garbage at Espinosa cigars.
I don't go to McDonald's, Burger
King or none of that bullshit,
you know, because you pay for
later on life.
So if we're going to go out to
eat, we're going to go out to
eat.
And and I deserve it, man.
If you got people that are with
you, you know, I don't mind
spending the money on my guys.
I really don't, you know, I
remember I'm a big fan of Dana
White, not the UFC as much as I
am a fan of his, just some of
the things that he says, dude.
And I remember during COVID he
said that, you know, I ain't
firing nobody during COVID, you
know, call me whatever you need.
This is what you got to do.
And he found that out because he
had it And Joe Rogan, I think
gave him these concoction, told
him what he had to do or
whatever.
And, and I remember my CFO
telling me, listen, bro, I don't
think we, you know, we got to
let some people go out to non
negotiable, right?
Non negotiable.
If we don't have the money, I'll
sell my house or I must.
We go broke first.
I'd go broke before 100% before
I'd let go of people in tough
times.
And, and they know that.
So, you know, a lot of my guys
don't want to go nowhere.
You know what I'm saying?
I was telling the grass is not
greener on the other side.
You know, why would you want to
go somewhere where you got a,
where you got Agps up your ass?
Right.
I don't think they're looking,
buddy.
I don't think they're looking.
You know, there's too many,
there's, there's too much
entertainment alone going on at
a Espinoza cigarettes to go
anywhere else.
You know, I do want to talk
about one other thing as far
kind of that comes out of Lisona
Palooza.
It's one thing that I've always
noticed is your dad is always
there.
Yeah.
Your dad is always with you 100%
of the time, I mean.
That's my ride or die bro.
Yeah.
So like what, you know, how, how
is that relationship kind of
formulated?
Was he, was he a hero to you
growing up?
Like what was he to you?
And you know, where is your
relationship now currently,
right?
You know, being Hispanic, we
think differently than a lot of
Americans 'cause I hear horror
stories I hear.
And there's nothing wrong with
that.
Everybody raises their kids that
however they want, you know, but
most Americans, when their kids
turn 18, they're.
Out they gotta go.
Gotta go.
Not us.
We we don't want them to leave,
right?
You know, we want to stay with
us.
Yeah, we want them to get
married and all that.
But you know, you don't gotta
leave.
You, you're innocent now if
you're a bum and you don't have
a job and you don't know this,
right?
You're playing video games,
you're smoking weed all fucking
day, right?
Then it's a different story,
right?
But my, I don't know, I've never
asked my dad this, but my dad
would do things for us to hate
cigars.
I'll give an example because one
of the one of the things I hated
the most in the life were
cigars.
No shit.
I mean, my dad being Cuban, he,
I laugh at people and they tell
me, hey, I have a come over to
my house.
I have this man cave to smoke
cigars.
Dude, the whole house was a
fucking man cave.
My dad was smoking the toilet.
My dad could be taking the dump
and smoking a cigar.
I swear in my life, I'd turn in
the car one time.
I want my dad to change cars.
The whole gauges, you couldn't
see it.
I swear in my life, the guy gets
in.
You know how they do that test
run?
The guy goes, dude, I didn't
even know how fast I was going.
I can't fucking see it.
And it was brown.
I mean brown.
And he would chew the cigar.
And whenever we're, I must be
8-9 years old, he'll come by us
and go like this with a cigar
and you're like, you know,
you're spitting it.
And you'll never see my dad
without a cigar.
And it looks like a paintbrush.
Now, I know you might not
believe me, but my dad eats
cigars.
Being Cuban, my dad's been
smoking cigars since I think
he's 12.
You know, in Cuba, that's how
you did, you know, you work in
the farm and, and, and, and you
would chew tobacco and, and I
mean, smoke cigars.
And then, you know, one day I
just look at me now.
But the relationship was, you
know, especially now he goes to
the warehouse.
You know, he's a little older.
You know, he's 89 years old.
God bless him and.
You know, we've always been a
tight family.
I've never my life ever have we
my dad and I've ever got into an
argument.
I just I mean, we've gone back
and forth on something,
especially baseball and shit,
and but we live.
I've three sisters and a
brother.
Yeah, that's.
Just a baby that's fucking
around but.
With three sisters and, and, and
with three girls and two boys
and we're very, very tight.
And, but we live to see my dad
mad even at 89.
We'll never regret it.
All the shit that we do to him
just because he's a firecracker
dude, he, he'll get upset in two
seconds.
Like people making the line to
go see Guy Fieri, you know, and
then he's got his little cart
there driving around and he's in
the fucking way.
I said, Dad, you got to move.
This place is mine.
I got to fucking go, bro, you,
you're blocking everybody.
They can wait.
Let me get my picture first.
All right, I said Guy, let's go
get get his picture.
He wanted the pitch.
Yeah, he got a.
Fucking Pitch.
He don't even know what the fuck
guy.
He has no fucking idea.
He's never watched diner drive.
You know, he speaks very little.
You know, he understands,
especially the cuss words and
all that, you know, Spanish.
But I remember one time I got to
tell you this funny story.
So we used to have a pig farm,
OK?
And and it's ironic, dude, our
pig farm was next to Oliva.
Well, Leva had a pig farm too.
And since they made my very
first cigar, I'm going back
years ago.
And when I get to the house, you
know, I show him the cigar and
he and he goes, who's making
this for you?
Now?
My dad don't know no shit about
cigars.
He knows the short filled shit
they used to sell before I got
in the business.
You know, they were selling the
grocery stores and and
cafeterias.
So he tells me that and he goes,
oh, Leva who Gilberto?
I'm like, dad, how the fuck you
know this?
We had the pig farm together.
Why?
Anyway, so we we used to go pick
up like.
Small world.
In the summertime, like bread
and milk, you know, to feed the
pigs, right?
And my dad has these big arms
and shit.
And, you know, he didn't speak a
lot of English.
So he's getting into this
argument with this guy.
And then my dad's ready to kill
this guy.
And he tells the guy fucking my
mother.
And the guy goes bring it to me.
But he's like, he's trying to
say motherfucker, right?
But he's saying fucking my
mother.
I don't know what to do.
But I'm like 8-9, ten years old,
you know, and then he gets in
the car, I'll pissed off some
guy that separated them and all
that shit.
And he goes, what was the guy
telling me?
I said that you tell him to fuck
your mother.
It looks like he got fucked that
one.
But that, that, that, that was
our, that was our, you know,
that was our story, dude,
growing up.
But we're very, very, very
tight.
So he was.
So he's always kind of been a
hero to you.
Then I would have said.
Absolutely, dude, he's very,
very I'm a spitting image of
him.
Dude.
He he, he straight for he don't
give a fuck.
He don't sugarcoat a fucking
thing.
He tells people what you got to
tell them and he don't give a
shit who's around them.
He doesn't care, you know, but
right, you know, he doesn't
disrespect.
Nobody tells people, you know,
if you're wrong, you're wrong.
And and I'm a spitting image and
and you know, you know, he's my
hero.
Of course he's my hero.
He's, you know, a lot of things
I learned and I didn't learn a
lot from him because he was
always working to provide
gotcha, you know, and everything
I had to learn and I, I, I never
held it against him 'cause I
know what he did.
He's.
Not like he was screwing around.
Right, right, right.
But, but we always remember
we're five.
If he bought 1 bike, he had to
buy 5 bikes, right?
You know what I'm saying?
And, and growing up, you know,
we lived, we came from Cuba.
We were in the hood, dude.
I mean it, it was, you know, we
were in the hood, the hood.
I remember one time, I think I
was three years old and I still
remember this.
I swear to my, my life, I don't
remember how old that was, 345
years old.
And we remember those pinatas.
So we, I pulled the pinata and
bro, people came out of the
woodworks.
I mean, they, they, they came
out of the wood.
I didn't get one fucking candy.
I mean, it was in the back of
the, of these projects and, and
everybody just came out of the
woodworks.
Dude, I didn't even get one.
And I'm crying and said, you
know, right, That was us growing
up.
I'm sure a lot of people have
their stories.
You know, we didn't, we didn't
have a lot of money or anything
like that, you know, and, but
he's definitely my hero, bro.
He, he's a bad motherfucker,
bro, 89 years old and, and he's
taking and he goes to cigar bro.
He steals my cigar.
He takes cargo pants.
So my mom, my mom is a
prankster.
So my mom weighs him.
You know what the, there's a big
scale there for, for the
pallets, right?
So we weigh him when he gets in
and then we weigh him when he
gets out to see how many cigars,
you know, he takes cargo pants.
They got pockets everywhere.
This is my fucking place, you
know, And I'm like, yeah, that
all right, You know what I'm
saying?
I remember one time Eric needed
some pictures of these, of this
box.
It was a new project we're
doing.
He goes in his office and grabs
him and fucking start smoking
them and shit.
And Eric, who took the other
cigars, we're trying to find out
everybody that knows we need it
for the picture.
So we had to bring the ones in
the bottom and put different
cigars and just set them up top
to because we only had 20
cigars, only one box.
Yeah, it was wrecking.
He's the best though all.
Right, so you know one person
that you never talk about though
is your mom.
My mom, my dad and my mom are
day and night day.
And my mom goes to church almost
every day.
My dad's don't gamble anymore,
but my dad used to be a drinker,
cigar smoker, and they meet in
the middle.
But my mom is my rock.
Yeah, that woman, I tell you
when that woman tells you
something, bro, I don't question
it.
She tells me, you know, she
prays for me all the time.
I got to talk to her every day.
If I don't talk to her once a
day, I'll help break sleep.
Yeah.
The next day.
You, you you forgot.
You have a mother, you know?
Yeah.
Yeah.
And she?
Hit you with a slipper.
Back in the day, I never got hit
a lot, but when I did it was my
mom.
And and remember that Richard
Pryor joke.
But my mom wouldn't you know, I
would tell her.
It never hurt, but I'll tell her
hurry up and finish.
You know what they would do with
the bell?
I told you not to hurry up and
finish.
Hurry up and finish your
sentence.
I mean, you know, but but my mom
is my rocket.
I tell you what.
Listen, we my daddy's nine
brothers and sister, and they're
all here in the States.
Holy moly.
Right?
And and we're the biggest.
We have 5 but another one has
four and the only three and two
and all the cousins my dad and
my momma's house where where
everybody hanged out at.
So anybody got any issue they
call my mom.
Anybody needs advice they call
my mom.
My mom is a rock mom.
I remember my mom telling me one
time I was 18 years old and I
used to use my brothers ID to go
to the club and she goes you
ain't going out.
And I said, Mom, I'm 18 years
old, you're not going out
tonight.
And my cousin's calling me,
dude.
I said, I'm embarrassed to tell
him.
I got to, I don't feel good.
I don't feel good.
But I couldn't tell him my mom
because, you know, that's a punk
move.
And then she woke me up like at
3:00 in the morning and said,
let's go.
Your cousin's in, in the
hospital.
He, he, he, he, he, he was
drinking and, you know, and you
got into an accident and, and he
hit a light pole on the side.
I would have been in, you know,
so, yeah, dude.
So I, I don't question my mom.
Well, my mom tells me something,
dude.
I don't I I don't question her
at all.
So you had four other siblings.
You have four other siblings.
Are you the oldest?
Middle.
I'm the youngest.
You're the baby.
I'm the youngest.
Yeah, got it.
I'm the youngest, bro.
Yeah.
Got it.
But we're very tight.
You.
I mean, they were all there.
Some other sister lives in
Tennessee, but you've seen them.
I don't know if I've introduced
him to it because, you know,
it's so busy and so hectic
there.
But.
But they're there.
They're there, Yeah.
No shit.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
No shit.
That's incredible, man.
See, I would've never guessed
you were so close to your
mother.
Oh, never would have guessed in
a million years.
I won't go to my dad.
I have so much respect for my
dad.
I'll give an example.
I would never get naked in front
of my dad.
I get naked in front of the
whole world.
Seriously, I'll never get naked
in front of my dad out of
respect.
I don't know what it is.
And so I try to incorporate that
with Eric.
So I would take showers with
Eric, you know, when he was
younger and stuff like that.
But everyone do it to me.
I remember that little fucker
one time we were at the trade
show and I'm there gambling,
whatever, and our crew and I
tell Eric, what you guys going
to do that now that I'm tired,
I'm going to sleep.
I said, all right, I'll see you
in the morning.
So then in the morning, I see
them struggling and I'm like, I
look at Anthony.
Remember when my graphic artist
Anthony and I tell them, you
know, now I'm digging.
I said, what's going on?
I heard you guys went out last
night.
He goes, yeah.
Where'd you guys go?
To the strip club.
Oh, nice, who's there?
I mean, this is before he got
married and all that.
And I said, who was there?
Oh, me, your son.
So and so so.
And I said, OK, motherfucker, I
said, why don't you fucking
invite me, bro?
You know, I guess it's a respect
thing.
He, you know, he, I would love
to have gone, but I don't know
if he can do that with me.
You know, your kids are young.
Wait till they get older.
You'll understand exactly
everything that I'm telling you.
You know what I mean?
Yeah, like, yeah, I won't be
incorporated on specific.
Things right?
They won't, you know, I don't
know which they.
Just don't want to.
You don't want.
They're worried about how you're
going to perceive them after.
Correct, But I'm the cool dad.
I mean, I'm, I'm the dad that
all his friends would hang out
with.
You know what I mean?
I'm the I'm the guy that you
know that they called me in the
office one day and he had this
loud horn.
I bought him a pickup truck and
they called me in the office.
It was a private school.
And you know, your son every
time at lunchtime blows his horn
and every day and the kids, he
scares the kids and all that.
I look at him this in front of
the principal.
True story.
So you do that every day and he
looks down, he goes, yes,
because he doesn't lie to me.
And I said, do me a favor, only
do it on Mondays and Fridays and
give the Tuesday, Wednesdays and
Thursdays off, you know.
And I look at the are we good
here, right.
What the fuck you calling me for
this bullshit?
You know, I fucking take off.
I'm that guy.
I'm that dad, you know?
What I mean, I'll talk to Eric.
I heard a little birdie told me
that you're actually into
meditation.
Yeah, but you meditate a lot.
I, I used to do a lot more.
I just feel that everybody needs
to relax the mind, especially
minds, minds.
Not that my mind races a lot.
It's just so much information, a
lot of useless information.
But I struggled with an anxiety
and my, my stepson suffered a
lot from anxiety and I really
thought that was a pussy shit.
I really thought, I thought that
was for weak motherfuckers, you
know, boy was I wrong.
You know, because you'd think
one way until it hits home,
right?
And and until you experience
your experience.
And then during COVID, I got a
real scare with I've never taken
a, a pill in my life.
At 50 years old.
I never took a pill in my life
ever.
You know, I'll take vitamins,
but never a pill, you know, of
course, it's the minor headaches
or whatever.
And then, you know, one day I
was at the warehouse and and I
didn't know anything about blood
pressure and this and none of
that bullshit.
And then I didn't feel good and
they called the rescue and all
this shit.
And anyway, I had high blood
pressure and then they put me on
these pills and I just wasn't
feeling right, you know.
And then I went to the doctor
and then they did a stress test.
Everything was fine with the
heart.
But when I when I did the stress
test that that you got to you
got to run and all that shit.
Doctor tells me, look, there's
something not right.
I need you to do a sonogram, not
a sonogram.
What is that called?
When you you you go into the
tunnel and they put MRI, not MRI
but with the iodine and all of.
The CT scans, yeah.
Whatever it's called.
So the day I go there, you know,
no big deal, I'm going to go do
it.
The lady looks at me and she
says we got to put a Nitro under
your tongue, we're going to
throw iodine and we got to give
you an IV.
And I kind of freaked the fuck
out.
I'm like, what the fuck, Nitro.
I know nitro's build bombs, You
know, what the fuck?
And I kind of freaked out that
day.
And then she looks at me.
She's Have you taken Viagra
Silas with him?
The first within 24 hours.
I said yes, I took one last
night.
Bullshit.
I.
Just wanted out I.
Just wanted out and and she said
well, I'm not going to be.
We could still do it, but it
won't breed.
I said, I'll come back and I, I
never went.
And my doctor kept saying you
got to go, you got to go.
So during that period that I
didn't do it, I was kind of
freaking out.
So then, you know, I, I didn't
know what anxiety was that I
really didn't, you know, And,
and then that's when I develop
it.
And then, you know, I started
talking to people and shit like
that.
And then they say, you know, you
know, I remember Caldwell would
would have these little, these
little liquid that you put under
your tongue, you know, it, it's
like a CBD type shit.
And that will calm you down.
That shit works like crazy.
So I would, you know, I would
have hot flashers, dude.
And I thought I was just a
woman, you know what I'm saying?
And I experienced all this
bullshit.
And then I started meditating,
dude.
And all that shit went away, you
know, no shit.
Yeah, dude.
I started meditating, relaxing
the mind.
And I was, but my heart was
great because the next day after
I did it, the doctor calls me
and says, well, I got your
results back and I freaked the
fuck out dude.
I was fucking shaking.
I was fucking and I've never
gotten like that in my life.
And she's calmed down.
Everything is good.
If not, I would, you know, I
would have called you yesterday.
You have 7% blockage on one
artery, 8 on the other and 9:00
on the other.
And I tell her what, what does
that mean?
She says a doctor won't even
look at you unless you have 50%
on something.
You're fine, you know, keep
doing what you're doing and, and
whatever I need you to lose a
little bit of weight, whatever
and all this shit, you know, so,
so then, you know, and then I, I
started doing the meditation.
There's this thing called the
daily calm and I recommend this
to everybody do because you
know, I, I try not to sweat the
small shit, you know what I
mean?
So if you wake up in the
morning, you know, you that you
go to the gym and all that dude,
and you got the kids and you got
the business and you know, I'm
sure you have some stress in
your life and of.
Course you know it it.
Calms you down, dude.
And then you breathing
techniques and all that, you're
the martial arts.
You should do that.
When I used to do martial arts
that that would really relax you
when you're done because, you
know, you're so spent that you
don't want to do anything right.
And they teach you how to
breathe when you fight.
Breathing is a lot.
Oh yeah.
You know, And so I incorporated
all that and, and I'm fine now.
You know, I don't, you know, I
don't suffer from anxiety
anymore.
I don't, you know, I, you know,
but I'm that meditation shit.
Up like crazy.
Yeah.
I mean, it could always rear its
head back, you know what I mean?
Yeah.
Yeah, if you do the wrong right
thing, sure.
Everybody has it though, right?
Everybody suffers from anxiety.
When you have a big trauma in
your life, OK, that's when it
comes out, you know?
But unless you've had a big, big
trauma in your life, you know, a
lot of people don't because a
lot of people, you know, people
take things and there's some
people that are so laid back
that nothing bothers them.
And that's the way you should
live your life.
Super Chimp.
I can't.
Yeah, You're not built that I'm
not built.
I don't think I'm built that way
either.
I got news for you.
That's pretty incredible, man.
I heard also that you fancy
yourself as quite the chef.
I wouldn't say that I'm not a by
all means, I'm not a chef, but
one thing I do, I learned, and
this has nothing to do with guy
absolutely pre guy.
This is pre guy with all my
travels, whenever I go to a
restaurant and they have
something that that's good and
and whatever I ate, the best
thing that I ate in a
restaurant, which is I say is
above average.
It was spectacular.
I try to make it at home so.
Try and replicate.
It what I do is I get the menu,
I call and they can, I have that
menu.
Let me see.
I might order some.
I don't, but I just take a
picture of without them seeing
me.
I take a picture of of the
ingredients and shit.
And then I try to go make it at
home.
And and I learned that a lot of
people don't know these things.
People go to McDonald's and
Burger King, I feel, because
they don't know any better
really.
Once you try the pizza in New
York, you don't want to eat
pizza anywhere else.
And once you try the best, it's
hard to go backwards.
So I try to buy the best
possible ingredients whenever
I'm cooking.
I don't cut corners.
And when I when I cook, Am I
good chef?
Hell no.
Do I make good dishes?
Absolutely.
But.
What's your best dish?
Penny of the vodka.
Yeah, yeah.
That's your go to.
That's my goal too.
How?
Often do you make it?
Depends on my diet or not, you
know, but I, I, I've made that
dish in Philadelphia, California
Jersey.
I've been at home a bunch of
times, but I, I make it really,
really good.
And it's just little things that
people don't know.
Tiny little intricacies.
That's all it is and good
ingredients.
I usually tomatoes that are
called some Marzano tomatoes are
some of the best tomatoes in the
world.
A lot of people don't know and
it comes in a can.
It doesn't matter.
It comes in a can.
They're the best tomatoes.
I rinse them off, take that
canned flavor shit out of it and
and I make my sauce or gravy or
whatever, depending on what part
of the country we're in.
Because some people call it
sauce, some people call it
gravy, but it comes, it comes
out out of this world.
The secret is when you're done
with your sauce, because I put
prosciutto, onions, all kind of
shit in there.
When you're done with your
sauce, you got to get a frying
pan and then you put the penny,
then you put your sauce and then
you grade the cheese and then
you put a little bit of parsley
or whatever, but then you let it
sit there and you're like
refrying it.
So you're like sort of sauteing.
It now becomes thick.
No kidding.
Yeah, just by doing that little,
because some people do the
pasta, the sauce and they put it
together.
Here you go.
No, it won't work that.
Way it's a process.
It's a process.
You got to do.
It Yeah, and I do a phenomenal
white chocolate bread pudding.
Really.
How have we not had this,
Palmer?
Have we not had this?
You don't.
Sounds amazing.
You don't have a kitchen here.
Dude, you know what?
I'm going to go.
I'm going to make this a thing.
I'm going to make sure that when
whenever you come up again,
whenever that is.
We'll do it from your house or
wherever you give me.
Give me a stove.
All I need.
All I need is an oven.
I I'll tell you what.
I'll tell you the ingredients,
how you do it, OK?
And and and I'll, you know,
I'll, I'll show you the process.
OK.
And you pay me a little bit of
royalties for the for.
Well, you got to make, you got
to make the ashtray back.
So I'll tell you how I did this.
I went to a place, it was a
restaurant.
If I'm talking too much, bro,
let me know.
No, you're good.
We go into this restaurant and I
ordered one.
I ordered the, you know, the
dessert and it was incredible
and I couldn't wait to go back
to this place.
The food was OK from 1:00 to
10:00, it was a 6-7, but the
dessert was a 10.
And I go back another day and I,
I tried to make it at home, but
it wasn't doing it.
Couldn't do it.
I went back again and I ate one
there and I took one to go.
And in the morning I woke up and
I went to get a little slice of
it and it was hard.
The white chocolate was hard.
And I said now I got you,
motherfucker, because I used to
do the white chocolate.
Chips.
What they use is a brick.
I said now I got your ass and
then I started doing the brick
and now it tastes the same.
It's fucking delicious.
The and I put Raspberry,
blueberry on top strawberry.
You first engineered.
It yeah, that's how I got.
Look at you.
That's how I got those
motherfuckers.
That's hilarious, man.
I love that dude.
All right, couple brief things
to surmise and then we'll wrap
this up.
Number one, you lost a fucking
bet fair and square.
Look, I don't think I did look.
I love I I just want you to know
I cherish the.
Fact.
Well, let's tell America what
the bet was.
I I have no problem.
I.
Cherish the fact that you
continue to be upset about the
fact that you lost, that he
lost.
He doesn't like the.
Lawyer I I paid my I I paid up.
You did you pay all.
I thought it was a Gray area.
And Espinoza always pays his
debt, I guess.
OK, I thought it was a Gray
area.
Yeah, OK.
I I don't remember exactly some
of the details of the bet, but
and I'll tell America.
I, I said, I said, listen, if
come election time, something
big will happen, it'll be either
COVID, either be something that
that because.
You go ahead and tell yourself.
Both.
Both.
I like the smug look on
Michael's face.
Go ahead.
And tell yourself.
You and I both know that all
these politicians are full of
shit, of course.
OK, so they're going to do
everything possible.
So my bet to you was that
something big was going to
happen.
Either another COVID, a fucking
disease, the fucking banana,
chocolate, strawberry disease,
some big shit was going to
happen.
Chocolate strawberry disease,
right?
Banana, chocolate, strawberry,
whatever.
Whatever the fuck it is should
be Minnesota or Strawberry.
Yeah.
And we got a date.
Yeah.
And the day came and you text
me.
But I think two or three weeks
before that, the Democrats
changed their candidate from
Biden to Kamala, right?
Never in the history of the free
world had.
We and I think that's huge.
That's fucking big, dude.
Yeah, that I, I will agree with
you.
That is you just nominate
somebody 100%, right.
That's huge.
And and that's why the the bed
is still a Gray area, 'cause
that's big.
OK, Now, if I didn't use the
word, something big would really
happen.
And then I shut the fuck up and
I lost, right?
OK, now if I just said banana,
cherry, strawberry, fucking
disease or COVID, another of
COVID, Yeah.
And then you want fair and
square.
OK, but if I use the word big
then I think it's a little
fucking Gray.
So let's back this up for you.
All right, now you hear you.
Here's.
What I love about you, I love, I
love you to death.
All right, when you get on your
tangents, OK, you're you're
elevated right a little bit and
you're going right, right.
And you say verbatim, OK, I will
bet that they are going to shut
down the entire country again
for COVID.
And I said, I'll take that bet.
And you said, all right, well,
you had said specifically it
would be like June.
And I said, OK, that's perfect.
I'll take.
That I'll give it to August.
Right.
And then and then you said whoa,
whoa, whoa, give me a little
more time since it's very since
it's so specific, I'm going to
need some more time.
And I said no problem, I'll give
you more time.
Pick the date.
When do you want to pick the
date?
So at that moment, I wrote it
down in my calendar and I showed
it to you.
I said here it is.
Here's the bet verbatim, and
here's the date in which the bet
expires.
Yes, you you sent me the date
that it expired, yes.
And the date, Yes, you did.
Specifically what it was.
I would have to go through my
texts I don't think
specifically.
I'm not a, I'm not a bet.
Listen, I lost.
I paid my.
Debt.
I love, yeah, but I love this.
I love I paid my debt.
Of course you did.
I think you got to give me
another chance because there's
still.
We can do another, we can do
another one, that's fine, but.
I think there's we.
Can do another, we can do
another.
And by the way, I give 3 flying
fucks about the ashtray and the
and the of course and and and
whatever I said.
I don't even know what the hell
I sent you, but you know I I did
good on the bet, but I hate to
lose.
I know, I love that you're.
Probably the only guy in the
country that ever beating yeah.
But I was gonna.
You know Abe have those dollar
bills and all the beat me too.
I.
Was gonna, I was gonna say, I
was gonna have you say I lost to
a dollar to a, but someone else
is already doing that.
I have.
Two of them from him.
Yeah, yeah.
You have two dollars.
From a I have a $5.00 bill and A
and I had a 10 but I was broke
in Vegas.
I think I put in a.
We could have Eric sign the
ashtray.
But I had I had two somewhere.
I think I have him in the
office, but I have two for me.
Yeah, I I don't bet unless I'm
I'm like, no, but I listen, I
lost.
I can't.
I will tell America, right.
All your listeners.
I lost.
I lost.
You can't win them all.
I lost.
You can't win them all.
It's just not.
It's just.
Not because the details is my
fault.
I I wasn't specific and I blame
myself.
I don't blame you.
Well, you were specific.
That was why I took the bet.
Something big did happen,
though.
That's not what you said.
The first time in history.
It's not what you said at the
time.
You know, of course George
Washington didn't do that.
Abe Lincoln didn't do that.
Yeah, I got it.
Action that.
Listen, George Washington didn't
go to his mother's funeral.
What are you?
What are you?
What are we trying to?
What are we saying here?
You know, Abe Lincoln fought a
guy in a ditch.
I mean like, come on.
Nobody's done that, you know.
To equal the height.
I don't know.
It's crazy.
Yeah, dude.
OK.
A little bit of business talk
and then we're going to move on.
All right?
We're going to go upstairs.
We're going to have a good time.
We're going to sell some Eric
Espinoza cigars.
There we go.
It's going to be fantastic.
OK, so COVID hits and then
shortly thereafter you partner
with Guy, right?
Yeah, actually, it was the day.
It was the Friday before the
shutdown.
Really.
Yes.
Abe's event was that Saturday.
OK, I meet him on Friday, I go
to Saturday after AIDS event to
to the Food and Wine festival.
No kidding.
And then Sunday and then Monday
it should.
I remember going to the TPE in
January and and you had people
wearing masks and I've never
seen that.
Yeah, it's crazy.
I.
Didn't know what the fuck that
was about and I'm always a
prankster.
I would see the Asian girl had a
mask on that and I'm thinking
the smokes bother and I look at
her and say you have a you have
a lighter I can borrow just to
fuck with her because she had
the mask on and shit.
And of course, no English, no
English whatever, but.
You stay away from.
Me, I I didn't know what that
was about, right?
I never experienced that, you
know, and then and then that
Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday is
when it it, you know it.
Yeah.
You had the shit hit the fan.
I think we were coming back from
Philadelphia and we started to
see people wearing masks and
stuff, right, Palmer?
I believe that's what it was.
Yeah.
So.
But anyways, OK, so tabling the
2020 year and looking at
20/21/22 or 23 and 24, right?
So four years, I think that you
have scaled a lot.
You've been very successful in a
lot of things.
Are you as far as your company's
concerned?
I'm, I, this is me just
spitballing here, but I think
that that's accurate.
Are you where you want to be?
No, no, not even close.
Not even close.
No, not even close bro.
No, but I have the same issue
that every other boutique brand
has.
How do you get to the regular
guy who don't know shit about
cigars?
Sure.
Can you sell more to guys who
don't know shit about cigars?
You know, I compete with with,
you know, the the malittal's of
the world, the soccer's of the
world, the skips of the world,
yourself and all that and we
have basically the same fan
base.
Sure, we share a lot of we.
Share a lot of consumers, but
the the the golfer or the guy
who don't know shit that goes
out and and gets the name
brands.
How do you get to those guys?
That's $1,000,000 question and
in my lifetime I've seen maybe I
would tell you maybe six
companies that have done that,
right?
They were where I was at, the
Rocky Patel's and the Predomos,
the Olivas.
You know, that's the $1,000,000
question.
How do you do that?
Yes.
Has Guy helped?
Absolutely.
Of course, I've had a lot of
celebrities that I've sent boxes
of cigars through Guy, the Al
Pacino.
But Al Pacino, I don't know if
he's ever smoked a cigar, right,
You know, Right.
You know, if I send him a box
and he don't snap a picture with
it, you know, I would love him
to snap a picture.
I'll post the fuck out of it.
But you know, that's the
$1,000,000 question, bro, how do
you get, just like you, you, you
know, you, you ship product.
How do you how do you get to to
the guys who, you know, who
smoked the Monte Cristos and
their Romeos and you know, and
stuff like that, you know,
that's, you know, their name
brands, they're very powerful
and but I want a piece of that.
So that's your vision.
You want to you want to get into
that piece of the pie.
Well, sure, but whoever doesn't
tell you that they want to do
that, it's it's insane.
And I know that some people do
their business differently and
and they're content of where
they're at.
You know, I don't, I'm not going
anywhere.
I don't want to sell this
company, you know, I want to
leave it for my son, you know,
but I I need to leave it, you
know, flush.
You know what I'm saying?
I'm not complaining.
Don't get me wrong.
No.
No, we that's not what the.
Question was right, right.
But but here I'll tell you, your
listeners this probably probably
cigars you don't smoke or Mike
or a lot of your consumers,
Connecticut, right.
That's the number one selling
wrapper in in the world
Connecticut at least in this
country, you know, but we don't
smoke it.
I mean, you might smoke one or
two, you know?
Smoke two of them a day.
Do you?
I do.
I don't.
Because I made a badass 1.
OK, All right, cool.
Now you made.
Some I made, I made some of
this, a couple of good ones, but
it's not but Chicago, yes.
But here's the thing, a lot of
people don't talk about that.
You know when when you know,
it's got to be medium to full,
you know, when's the last time
you heard, Oh, I smoked this
great.
You know, Connecticut cigar.
You don't hear that.
You do hear, but not as much as
you do the other ones.
But you smoke, you sell more
Connecticut than anything, you
know, And, and that's, that's
the target.
How do I get the guy?
And it's the $1,000,000
question.
And how do you educate that
kind?
Because a lot of those guys are
smoking.
Bullshit Connecticut what they
don't know right and I don't
think they care no, I don't
think they care.
How do you make golf course and
how do you make them care?
And that's why Jewish stage is
so important to our industry,
man, because it's a gateway
cigar.
Sure, when I used to wrap them,
you know, and, and they start
smoking the ass in the fat
bottom bed and then they move
up, you know, and, and but how
do you get them to smoke?
Like, listen, I do fantastic
with grandma, you know, the, and
the knuckle sandwich
Connecticut, but I can't get it
to the everyday Joe Small, you
know, how do I get those guys or
women?
It's tough.
Yeah, it that's, that's the
$1,000,000 question.
So is that what you're planning
on working on?
Absolutely.
That's, that's something that
you know, I'm targeting.
How do you do it, though?
You know, it's hard.
I remember Rocky, I know how
some people got there.
Rocky had three great hits
back-to-back to back, which he
had the, the edge, the Java and
the vintage.
And he had three monster hits
back-to-back.
And that escalated to to
probably the Big Smoke.
Just to give you an idea, I'm in
the Big Smoke about a month ago.
I have the magazine.
They did an article on me in the
Big Smoke.
I got one of the and Cigar
Aficionado, one of the highest
rated cigar.
OK, we got both magazines.
They're showing.
And I'll be honest with you.
You know there was 4000 people
there.
I took maybe 50 pictures, right?
You know, it's not a lot.
I I I took a hell of a lot more.
But when Guy was next to me,
yeah, but Guy wasn't there.
I.
Was going to drop that joke.
Right, right, right. 2 for two.
But but guy was was there the
second day.
The first day, right?
I mean, these are guys that read
Cigar Aficionado.
I have no idea what the fuck has
been.
No, I'm not going to sit here
and lie to you and tell you all
you know.
Everybody knows.
Do you know who I am?
Right.
A lot of people don't know what
the fuck Rocky Patel was.
No, you know, and and that's my
point.
There's people go there and then
and then you tell them you ever
heard of a six O 1 Michelle go a
knuckle sandwich This that Now
what do you smoke?
You know, and and then they they
tell your brand that you're
like, oh, OK, so I I'm like, you
know, I I give up once I hear
the brand that they show.
I'm done with you, you know, but
but you advertising Scott
aficionado, I'm out there.
I've been to every state I've
I've been to mostly I will tell
you 70% of every retail shop in
the country.
Not everybody knows where the
fuck we are, right, You know,
and and how do you get there?
You got to keep knocking on
doors.
And then I don't know what the
formula is.
If anybody, any of your
listeners know what the formula
is, I'm all ears, bro.
I'm, I, I, you know, I'm, I'm
all ears.
Listen, I don't need to tell
you, you know the struggles.
Yeah, no shit.
I don't have to tell you.
Yeah, absolutely.
Anybody comes out to me and tell
them you're a crack of shit to
get the fuck out of here.
One thing I don't do is lie,
dude, you know it is.
Listen, every year the trade
show, we sell more.
You know, every year we sell
more.
This year's a little flat for,
for mostly everybody.
You know, I, I got to have a big
month, you know, to, to, to
surpass last year.
But I talked to everybody.
Everybody's flat.
Everybody's, you know, Yeah.
And the economy is?
Yeah.
Well, I mean, but realistically
when everybody says they're
flattened, you're probably.
Down.
They're probably down, right?
One thing about me, dude, I'm
too old to lie, 'cause you got
to remember your lies, you know?
I'm down.
But I got some new things.
I got the Chicago shipping, the
6th province.
I got a bunch of shit.
Yeah, you got a lot of things.
Right.
That, that that will probably
get me there.
You know, if we're up, not a
hell of a lot and if we're down
not not I have a lot, but every
year my goal since I started the
company, we've been up.
You know, every year grows, it
grows and it grows and, and the
more and more people getting to
know we are, you know, and.
I think that's true.
Yeah, I honestly do.
Yeah, you know more.
We're not flat.
We're, you know, we're
definitely climbing.
We're on the right path.
I think you have more people in
the zone of this year than you
did the past.
Two years, I can put 1000 people
in there.
Just kidding.
I don't know where the hell to
take them though.
Yeah, you know what I mean?
And and I don't mind doing that,
but you know, it's so intimate.
It's so you know, we don't have
a big space.
So that's the reason.
So who do I invite?
The people that post a cigar,
cigars the most and and buy a
cigar the most.
Yeah.
It just felt like to me that
there was more there.
I'm going to tell you right now,
yeah.
It could have been I, I don't
know, you know, my son handles
all that, but you know.
Because I want to go hide in the
back.
I was like, let's go hide that.
Let's go you.
You, you, you probably in
Hector's office all the.
Time I stopped to see Hector,
Yeah.
And then we then the conference
room was was pretty cool with
Jack and Tyler to hang out with.
Them for Mike Tyson?
Fuck there.
What the fuck wage?
I can't get those two hours back
in my.
Life.
Well, you know.
It was so script though not to
change conversation, but that
was script.
Well, we can end it on that.
So, you know, at the end of the
day, you got a guy that's really
good at marketing.
Yes.
And then you have another guy
who's not going to say no to 20
million fucking dollars, you
know what I mean?
I mean, imagine, right?
Like, hey, you got to show up.
You're going to get paid 20 mil,
you know, legacy intact.
We're going to protect you.
We're going to protect.
And I'm going to tell you right
now I don't.
I think that it took a minute
for Mike to slow down like when
he started off the gate.
Yes.
He was like, yes, like he
wanted.
No, that.
Did you see him train?
Yeah, of course.
It's nothing that what he did.
No, there is there.
Is this a guy like that?
You know a legend like that.
I know you don't believe me, but
I look you straight in your eyes
and I swore in my life I
wouldn't do it.
What, the 20 million?
No, I actually do believe you.
There's no fucking way I'm going
to sell my soul for any amount
of.
Money.
Well, you think that he sold the
soul.
I don't think he's fucking.
I don't think, well, he's old
people.
Gave him a pass because he's old
and probably people gave him a
pass, but he looked like an ass
when he's told his brother I'll
fight you right.
You know, And that's why I know
something, because he's showing
he wasn't.
He wasn't even there.
Yeah, OK.
And and and when he told his
brother I'll fight and his
brother said I'll kill you.
You know what I'm saying?
I, I, I know of a script.
A million percent have to be
script because there's no way in
the world guy because he's a
monster now.
He was biting his gloves and I
don't care what nobody said,
what are you doing when he fight
very little.
He was biting his gloves the
whole fucking time not to throw
a fucking punch.
And listen, don't throw a punch,
motherfucker.
Don't you know what I'm saying?
Of course there's no fucking way
that you know I would have put
my life, you know that Tyson was
going.
I was hoping he clocked the
motherfucker and all that, you
know what I'm saying?
But but something was wrong
there, you know?
And listen, he needed the money.
He wanted to do it.
Hey, Amen.
Congratulations.
Whatever.
He's 59 years old, right I'm. 57
dude and I promise you promise
you give me two months and I
would have had a better showing
than him.
OK.
But at the end of the day,
right, he's 59 years old.
He's kind of he's not got
nothing to prove, right?
He's he's that's.
My point?
He's done a lot of these great,
but.
He's making good money now.
What?
I'm told.
I could be wrong.
He's got the weed business.
He's got sure gummy ears with
the ear bit off and all the
bullshit.
Yeah, yeah, You know, So did he
need the $20 million to do a
fucking?
You know, you find $20 million
on the ground, gonna pick it up,
you're gonna fucking kick to the
curb.
But.
Look, you know.
At the end of the day, I think
that the reality is he's 59
years old.
So, you know, no matter how
great you are, we all still
tuned in, I guess.
It was on Netflix.
But I'll never do it again.
Well I wouldn't have bought it
but it was on Netflix and I did
the buffering and I get fucking
frustrated the whole time, dude.
We were at the, our warehouse
and, and I thought it was me.
I was so embarrassed.
I, you know, every, every 5
minutes.
But then I realized it was the
whole country, right?
They got, they got, I guess
they're I think they're being
sued.
Are they?
That's a bigger thing.
Like, you know, Netflix not
having the capacity to handle
that was was definitely the
biggest egg on the face for the
entirety of the whole thing.
And they had some good look.
They even put some good fights
before it.
Are you a boxing fan?
No, but you know, I was watching
those fights and I'm like, damn,
this is really good.
You know, I'm a I'm I'm a
competitive fan.
Like, I like the I, I like UFC,
you know?
The cigars very good, by the
way.
Thank you.
Thank you, Sandra.
Yeah.
Postonic, Postonic.
Postonic.
Postonia.
Postonia.
Yeah, that one won't come.
And why Postonia?
What is that?
Because it means uprising.
Uprising.
Yeah.
OK, so why is the arrow pointing
down?
Well, because it's actually
Polish revolutionaries, we
repeat with an anchor.
OK.
So we just kind of modified
that.
How many letters are in your
last name?
15.
How many aren't Schwarzenegger?
It's a real question.
How many of those 1414 one
better you up them?
That's it, That's it.
And how do you pronounce your
last name?
It's Shepon Kevitch.
Shepon Kevitch.
Yeah.
Good stuff, right?
Yeah, that's not coming out to
the show, but.
You know, I'm sorry, I didn't
mean to tell the whole world.
No, you're good, you know, I
don't care.
But I wanted you to have
something special, you know?
This is a special.
Occasion.
I love this size, bro.
Yeah.
So guys, really good bro.
Congratulations.
Thanks, Ben.
I'm working with good people.
That's what it is.
You got to work with good people
for, you know, but you can trust
people.
You can trust and and you know,
and yeah, because a lot of those
people don't know that this is a
chain here.
And who makes the skip.
Yep.
OK, so.
Right.
So, yeah.
So almost.
So see, here's the difference.
They, they have their own
company and they know that it's
a chain because if they make bad
shit, you understand we're not
making Cuban cigars here That,
that, that are dog rockets and
and nobody complaints and they
don't ship it back.
So when when they make cigars,
it's got to be done right
because this.
It's a reflection of their
brand.
No doubt.
Yeah, Everybody knows they make
it and and and it's a chain.
One guy can get one that doesn't
draw a ride or whatever, then,
OK, you know, they give another
shot.
But yeah, I do.
But when when you don't have it
when it's back ordered, they go
on trying another.
Thing and they don't even
remember the fucking brand dude
the one with the letter the the
809 you talking about the 601
yeah yeah yeah that one yeah
dude they just happened upstairs
a.
Guy came in and he said oh,
Johnny something.
It was a Johnny Cigar, like
Johnny Tobacco.
No, not that one.
It's got red lettering.
Red lettering on it.
What the fuck is this guy
talking?
About.
So then you go back, you look at
the data, you try and figure out
the customer name, the customer
ID, when he made the purchase,
we can't find the data.
Like what the fuck?
Like what is this guy?
Did he come in here?
Was this the you know?
What was it?
Oh.
I don't know.
I don't know what they finish
up.
We went downstairs.
Yeah, we went downstairs.
Like that hecho mano guy, he
makes all the cigars in the.
The guy's crushing.
It he has a fucking bad dude.
Dude, yeah.
Yeah, it's, you know, Placencia,
you know, there's 11 tier lower
than Hecho Mano.
Yeah.
Yeah, dude, the names of the
names that people come up with,
McDonald's, Macadoodles, Yeah.
The cows.
And the CEOs, the cows.
That's right.
A big cow fan?
Yeah.
You like the cows?
It's great.
All right, well, let's go
upstairs.
Let's.
Do.
This this has been a great
podcast man.
Pleasure, brother, you do it
and.
Thank you so much for coming on
and thank you so much for
driving up, dude.
Oh.
Dude, my pleasure.
I love you guys.
Do that this for me you know I
smoked a couple cigars up on the
way up here and and you know now
we're gonna rock'n'roll and And
I wish you nothing but success
you and your team, your family
brother.
You know I root for you guys and
I'm not that guy.
I don't look at you guys a
competition.
I look at you guys as friends
and then and there's enough room
for everybody.
That's what people don't
understand 100%.
There's no need to badmouth
anybody out there, you know
there's.
Unless they're crooks.
There's a couple guys, you know
what I'm saying?
And there's no need to badmouth
anybody out there, you know,
and, and, and I'm the guy that
buys cigars from everybody, you
know, People ask me, you know,
what do you smoke?
I smoke everybody's stuff,
right?
Not for me to know what they're
doing.
I just want to try different
stuff, right?
I get tired of smoking my own
shit.
I do want to mix it up.
Yeah, you want to mix it up, you
know, and.
Sometimes you want penny out of
vodka, you know.
Right.
Sometimes you want white
chocolate bread pudding.
Every day.
Every day is different, you know
that's but thanks for having me.
Thank you man.
I appreciate it you.
Got it, my brother.
All right, let's go.
None.
Show Notes
A in depth interview with Erik Espinosa