February 19, 2023· 1h 1m

Cigar Hustlers Podcast Episode 269 Roma Craft Part 2

Transcript

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So I so we actually have a lot,

we have a decent amount of be a

and Cro-Magnon right now in the

pipeline, right?

But once that's gone, it's going

to be gone for a year or two.

At least, we've exhausted a lot

of The avarice like I think the

average is sold out.

I think reach of the piece is

done.

So it, I mean we have it, it's

coming in but it's already

accounted for, right?

Right.

You know, and but there is a

decent amount of, there's

probably another 150,000 towards

I think based on based on the

numbers.

I think we'll probably be done

with, with Pro Magnum.

Probably at the end of March

first, part of April.

Yeah.

And now that we have our own pre

industry, we were taking a lot

of the light colored Connecticut

broadleaf the stuff that was on

wasn't really Cro-Magnon, we put

it back into Abalone so Now it's

got like a year more and alone

and it's been real low and we're

going to get a lot of rapper out

of that too.

But I don't know.

You know, Arlen sister kind of

took over as our sorting Iris

Agha, the, you know, the person

who sorts the cigars for

packaging and she's just like

super hardcore.

Yeah.

So our Segundo rate went up a

lot and instead you know instead

of saying hey hey You know,

don't don't be so picky, right?

I went back to the wrapper,

ladies and said, look, you know,

this is the standard, you know,

I don't know what it was before,

you know, I have never been that

concerned with the way.

The rapper looks but different,

I get it, I get, I get why, you

know, because especially now

it's like, well, Esteban left.

So the quality is going to go

down or whatever, so I'm like,

let's go the other direction,

right?

Equality is going to go up.

So let's just get better.

And let's use our new pre

industry to make our tobacco

even better, right?

So I mean, unless we've cut off

a lot of retailers.

So we've really like this year,

like I was having personal

issues with some people.

Right, you know, fake doctor's

notes.

And you know, Monday morning

flew and right, you know, just

problems that we did like yeah.

No, I don't.

I don't know if we had these, he

drank a day.

I didn't know if we had these

problems before, an s-1.

Just never told me, but it's

certainly not.

And I'm cool with.

So, or arlynn, right?

Who's, you know, hearted it

harder than me.

So, so we just like in December,

we said, you know what?

Let's just go down to ten Pairs

and let's just because we were

cutting back on retailers and

right.

It's like list.

We're going to make the same

amount of money either way,

right, I don't.

It's but let's just, let's just

simplify it.

Make it even better and you

know, dial it in, right?

Yeah.

Yeah, so that's what we've been

focused on.

So those lines are coming out

and then yeah, I've just been

trying to really tighten up a

lot because, you know, we've

always kind of been in charge.

I mean this is new for me to

really understand what my role

was the factory versus so you

know, we don't have to factory,

right?

And then Esteban don't have the

Factory and then now Mike and I

own the other second half of the

factory, right?

So essentially 100% of the

factories funded by Mike and I,

in either way you're always

matter how you slice it well and

post onions over somewhere

summits. the way it worked was,

I would kind of get involved in

making sure the tobacco's guy

was really involved in the

blending and like, this is the

product we're going to make,

right?

Because we didn't make a lot of

new products then it was okay.

Now you go, you're responsible

for going finding this tobacco

and keeping it the same, right?

And then, anytime any kind of

issue came up like, hey, can

they go change this year?

We would have a little powwow

about it but I wasn't really

that involved in the raw

material side, right?

In fact we as a company, weren't

involved that much in the raw

material side, we would go

select tobacco in the Dominican

and then a year and a half later

after Gus cure got done with it,

we would take the best of it,

and we never had to really worry

about it because it was just

always there and it was small

amounts.

So we always had large amounts

of inventory for the cigars.

We made, we always kept 800 a

million dollars worth of

inventory minimum so and

especially filler.

We never really worried about

because we need a 10 packs of

filler or 50 packs of filler.

We would just go get it a little

bit at a time from Raul, and

from Knoxville, and Yeah.

And it just doesn't work like

that anymore, right?

So we would we I was really

mainly kind of focused on from

the time, we started deveining

and drying it.

To how we managed it in the

bodega to how we got it to the

rollers, and buncher's, to how

the cigars were made, how they

were aged, how they were

packaged and then how they were

shipped and delivered, right?

And that was really where we

focus.

In fact, you know, Arlen

managed, most that inventory

process and it's all four years.

We've never had any issues at

all because it's just, I mean

like Hey, we're missing three

cigars from this.

We're missing a bundle of

tsugumi.

One little thing can change and

we you immediately notice it

because the tightness of the

project, right?

I've brought the process but on

the raw material side.

It wasn't like that total

opposite right from the

beginning.

It was like there was never like

that.

It was never like that.

And it was such a such a mean

for years, I would say to Mike,

hey, you know, He's not, you

know, we're not managing the

yields correctly, he's like

dude, you know, the costs are

the cost, you know, right.

Wait till it goes up on the

window in the kitchen, right?

And then you know whatever as

long as it's good he going don't

Don't Rock the Boat.

Yeah you know apply your

Insanity to that side, right?

So anyway now my Insanity has

been applied that side and we've

added 25 employees.

So we used to have like X number

of employees for every roller.

Bunch or now we have like, two

ex-employees from a bunch of.

We've had a lot of

administrative people for

tighter bookkeeping tighter

data.

That's amazing teenage man.

We added the warehouses and all

the staff over there.

I think we're now we have about

15 or 20 people over there.

We added a new chief of raw

material, who actually worked

with Esteban for years and

years.

Actually, a lot of the people

All that we have now are people

that that came up with them?

Yeah.

I mean it's still a small

industry, bro.

You know what I mean?

Yeah, it's not.

Yeah.

So our new raw material guy, you

know, is the interesting, the

great thing about him is not

only is he's a servant leader.

He's really smart.

And he's a good worker, good

work ethic, but he also has

always worked with these same

kinds of tobacco's and he's from

the same school, right?

So he was at Scandinavian Latin

cigar for 15 years and then he

was at knocks.

Oh, and now he's with us, the

lady, running our Esco hair, the

sorting and in classification

over in the bodegas, she was

actually with us in our first

year when we were behind us,

once housed lilium so she's

killing it.

She's got like, she brought like

eight or ten, really good ladies

with her.

And then you know, from the

factory perspective, you know,

the guy that we kind of had as

as our as our production manager

did wasn't really getting the

job done.

So we promoted a one of an

employee that's been with us for

ten years and he's one of our

best buncher's.

He's been he's doing this a long

time and he had back surgery and

really couldn't sit all day

anymore.

So I was like well we'll make

you you know This supervisor and

then it turns out, he's actually

a really really good leader of

production so he's been doing a

great job.

So Phil have you switch to

switch up the cameras at all?

Yeah.

Okay this is I see the first

part.

I seem kind of suck watching,

hang it on his fucking phone and

oh no, he was engrossed in the

show earlier.

So all the, all the pieces are

really fallen and push up, which

is awesome.

Now he's just click, it has been

a lot of work.

It's been a lot of work.

Yeah, I mean, you know, I think

that I mean, knowing you guys,

for over a decade at this point

was kind of scary for me to say,

I would say, probably six months

ago, maybe a little bit longer

maybe eight months ago there.

I could see that there was a lot

on your plate, and it was

definitely very stressful for

you.

Like, you were just, it was

like, it was like you were

handed this fucking gigantic

Christmas tree, fucking lights

knots and someone said he go

sort this shit out, right?

So you got a slowly break it all

down and you Tell that you were

working it out, you know, and

coming and seeing you this time

around obviously the knots

aren't completely kicked out but

things are definitely flowing in

a in the better in the right

direction.

Well, you know, I would say

November a year ago is kind of

so, kind of whenever the project

with Arnie Carrillo had really

kind of Kind of started taking

shape, right?

So we go to the Dominican and

you know, we start looking at

the process, they're doing.

We start looking at the way the

operation, how organized it is.

It not that we don't do that in

other factories because you do

but it's different, it's

different, right?

You know, you talking about a

guy who's got the organization,

just in the places where they

keep all of the, the vistas and

the labels and whatever

language.

You packaging materials that

they've got a process for

everything that goes in and out

and how it goes into the

production table.

So, all the Finish.

Cigars are going to get labeled

up and whatever you start kind

of looking at these things.

And I think even before that

just going in and looking at all

of, you know, Skip kind of down

plays like hey this project for

this Quinto Janerio.

It's like hey let's go look at

tobacco that neither one of us

really use right, right.

And so there was this this kind

of this like he rekindled this

this flame, right?

Because I think for, for you

know, last eight or nine years

like we just keep growing

growing growing and everything's

kind of on cruise control.

It's just keep it on tracks and

then, you know, it's like, hey,

let's let's go.

Look at this other Factory and

how they do it.

Let's go look at tobacco that

we're not using or not using.

And then it's like you know this

kid is candy shop, right?

And so becomes a little bit

comes fun again.

So then but then you come back

home and then you realize

there's some there's some

disorganization in your own

house and went with that

disorganization.

It's like you know you just kind

of turn a blind eye to it just

like your kid that just kind of

keeps his room a little dirty

right now.

It's like you know, but he's got

good grades.

Yeah he's doing all the right

things.

Things.

But you know this little little

messy and so making on a roll.

Yeah.

So it's like how about how hard

do you ride him right?

Right with that.

You start saying okay we need to

we got to clean up and so

November you know I get a phone

call saying hey I need you down

here right away and so we go

down there and you know, and

he's kind of telling me that

some of these things are kind of

going on, but it's not, it's

different to you like really see

it, right?

And it really just for context,

it really went off the tracks,

when I was in the states for

nine months for covid.

And it was make sense.

It was one of these deals where

not buy a beach though, just for

clarification.

All right, okay.

Was one of these deals where I

kind of always kept things on

the rails, right?

Even though it was kind of a

crazy train, it was like, okay,

I'm not going to go to the

kitchen and yeah, you know, make

sure all the stuffs labeled

properly right now.

Like, those kind of details,

they don't work like that.

I'll just drive him crazy.

So, I'm gonna stay right

kitchen.

Yeah, if it's being produced, if

you know that it's happening and

it's working, right?

You're not going to fuck with

it.

It right?

Yeah.

And and all the things we're

talking about, have nothing to

do with product quality, right?

Has nothing to do with quality,

it's intimate.

It's all about, here's what I've

learned in business.

It's about owning those gaps,

right?

Those little gaps of things,

that that aren't perfect, right?

And when you're away for nine

months, right?

Really where it showed up,

really, where it showed up, was

it showed up with how employee

employee satisfaction, how, how

they were reacting to things

that We're happening.

And it also showed up in the

money, right?

So we've always been super,

super efficient, and the way it

works is that the factory needs

money, Mike, and I send money,

and then when there's an

invoice, it comes off of that

deposit, right?

And then so, what was happening

was is that our deposit kept

getting bigger and bigger.

And so, what that means is,

you're consuming money faster,

right?

Then you're then you're selling

cigars and so when you start

looking down into the numbers,

And you start saying, okay, I

need this data.

I need this information from

this inventory.

I need to know what happened to

this binder.

I need to know what happened to

this seven bags of Tibet.

Where's your inventory is no

answer right there?

Yeah.

There's a lot of open questions,

right?

Yeah.

So if the money had gone thank

you.

I never really paid much

attention to how How much we

paid people like a salary wise,

right.

I understood the kind of overall

cost that were being told to me,

right?

I could that I, that we were

paying for the total, I'm

signing the checks, right?

But but then, but then when you

start looking at salaries,

you're like, is that, right?

And then you and then you, then

you go to other factors.

You say, hey, can you do me a

favor?

Can you tell me how much you

guys are paying the people who

do this, right?

What you guys paying the people

to do this.

And they're like, we pay this

and I'm like yeah we pay more

than that, right?

And look for you, you go to the

next place and you go well, we

pay a little more than that.

Why are the three Ferraris?

I found a nickel sueño but then

but then you start talking to

people and you start talking to

people and you go.

Yeah.

It isn't that it isn't that

we're making less than other

places, that's why we haven't

left.

But we're not happy because it's

not enough and I'm like, well

what do you mean it's not

enough.

It's like you know, even looking

at the numbers you know, it's

like So then you start looking,

okay, let me just take the data

and let me compare it to

Consumer Price, indexes and

exchange rate to dollar.

And you start realizing for

example, without getting to a

long long thing about it.

But but for example, there's a

big thing that changed.

There's a big thing that

changed, which is always in

Nicaragua, I'm trying to say in

a way that you understand is

Americans.

So you know how in your paycheck

you get FICA where you get 6

point like a one and a half or

whatever percent Medicare and

then your employer pays a

portion, right?

And then they take Federal

withholding and at the end of

the year, you file your taxes

and people aren't paid much

almost, get almost all their

taxes back, right, right.

Well, there is no filing your

taxes process in Nicaragua, but

most employees.

Don't pay.

Tax federal income tax

withholding if, unless you make,

unless you're a highly

compensated employees you don't

get you don't have to pay taxes

right in your page and payroll.

So like for example, the Social

Security portion that was with

all the trouble was in 2018.

So they change their their

portion from like 5% to like

seven and a half percent and

people lost their shit and also

because they want to take

benefits away etc.

Etc.

Because the world, I mean the

IMF told him we're not giving

you any more support.

If You don't fix your pension

program.

So there's always been a

Nicaragua if you make over.

Let's I don't know what the

exact number is.

I think it's like 120,000

quarter busy year if you make

more than 12,000 Court of a

month or something like that,

then that's when your you've

reached that level will now,

they're going to start taking

taxes, right?

So what was happening was the

hot more highly compensated

people in the factory.

Had been had already started

paying withholding like 15% of

their check.

So they're making less money.

Well, effectively.

Those people have always made

less months, but they were

making even less, because they

were, they were paying taxes,

right?

So, Um, what essentially is

happened is if you go back,

seven eight, nine years, the

exchange rate was like 17 18

quarter before a dollar.

Well, the exchange rate is like

36 Court of a ferocious it.

So let's say you used to make 70

almost double, so, right?

So it's half against are so used

to, let's say you made x70

quarter has 75 quarter but to

make 100 cigars.

Now you're making 120 quarter

but per 100 cigars but you're

really making less, right?

Because you're Not making.

Even if you were making 150 per

se you know then you would be

making about the same.

They killed on 75.

Yeah.

But if you add on top of that

now because instead of making

2224 hundred córdoba week, now

you're making four thousand

quarter of a week.

Now you're over this threshold

for the tax now, you're making

15% less, right?

So I started looking at all this

dating It's like, well, nobody

has said, but everybody's

bitching about people leaving

the United States.

Etc.

Etc, etc.

It's like well, you know it's

expensive.

It's like, yeah, but it's more

expensive to not take care of

people, right?

And, and our people weren't

leaving.

They were just grumbling, right?

Yeah.

And I didn't really even know

that, right?

So, they're like, what other

factories don't make their

employees pay.

These taxes in my care, they do,

right?

They just, they just give you,

you know.

More money off their table,

right?

Or do you know car or whatever

they're doing?

It's not legal, you know it's

your government says I have to

pay the tax on to pay the tax

but but we're going to do is

we're going to raise everybody's

salary and we're going to so

anyway, things like that, the

things like that is like where

it's like, okay in the gaps.

Yeah.

I mean, we probably were still

paying 10 5, 10 percent more

than most factories were and but

we went up a lot.

I mean, so all that of that is

to say that my Mike and I have

invested a lot of money a lot in

this year, getting things,

right?

So the goal the whole time has

been the piece that you see the

cigars and all that.

How do we not fuck that up,

right?

But then at the same time fix

everything else, right?

So that so that the fundamental

pieces of the business for

stronger and better.

And essentially what happened

was is that we had to get

stricter on what was a Segundo.

We had to overpay for tobacco to

get the right tobacco and, you

know, it basically, our costs

went up, / cigar our cost

probably went up 45 or Descent a

cigar.

Yeah I mean we felt it even in

the the stuff that you make in

post Tanya then.

Yeah.

You know those other things.

It was it was inevitable.

Yeah I'm not too much just a

price increases our room at our

costs have gone up.

All right well it all kind of

parlays and now finally we are

getting it to a point where now

that everything's right now.

We can start cutting in the

deficiencies again, right?

So it's like we became really

inefficient to keep it.

Good?

Right.

It's like just keep throwing

money at it so we don't fuck up

right thing.

And then now it's like, okay now

that we kind of get a grip on it

right now, we can go back.

Well, now that you're focusing

focusing on efficient on that

side as well, because you never

were before.

Yeah, but we had a partner for

me, probably invested.

Two million dollars this year,

keeping the Train on the tracks

and getting stuff, ready for the

next five or ten years.

And yeah, but so I mean I think

that the, when you, when you

look at it, it's like it's

everything, right?

It's like The Growing Pains of,

of any type of major investment

to go to the next level.

Like, you know, the kind of the

inefficiencies of that, you

know.

But then once but you realize,

like once you make these

sacrifices and you kind of do

these things like you can see

like the lighting of the tunnel

is so much better, right?

Like it.

Yeah, of course.

So, you know, and you know, but

but you know, we kind of make

fun and jokes of this.

It's like all the work that we

do on the back end.

Like, you know, in the consumers

themselves never really no

fucking have no idea, no fucking

idea which, you know, and at the

end of the day, that's that's

you go to a wedding and you

don't realize there's anything

that goes wrong, right?

Like the bride and groom have an

excellent time, right?

Because, you know, the Nazi lady

is making sure that everything

is on time right.

I'm sure they have it, right?

So, so like we make, we make fun

of Of that.

But at the same time, like these

long conversations in, you know,

it's stressful.

But at the same time, when you

stress, that's how you grow from

that, right?

Like use your us right?

Yeah.

So it's a used right?

It's a good stress.

Yeah.

So it's like, you know, you want

bigger muscles, you got to

stress the muscles, just the

muscles, right?

So they pointed to me.

Thank you Michael.

Going on, right?

It with any company, right?

It's like, yeah, you know, but

at the end of the day, you hope

that, you know, if they get a

ten dollar cigar, $12 cigar,

like then, and and they enjoy

it.

Like, that's the rewarded.

But the well, and I'll say, kind

of another way of saying what

Mike just said, but in the less

politically correct way is, are

you saying that you're not

politically correct when you

speak?

Well, okay, so this, this, this

fucking dumbass that made the

comment on the half wolf thing.

So this is the way the half

whole thing broke out.

Us anonymously.

And on this is how the halfway

thing broke out.

Somebody sends me a mess.

She goes.

Congratulations and I'm right.

Okay, for what?

For being factored the year, I'm

like, oh, thanks for saying that

which is awesome.

He's like, no, but half will

named JB the knob we've been

nominated as like the honorable

mention right?

Well, I thought you got the

award before.

I'm pretty sure you did in the

past 2017.

Yeah, you got Factory in the

impact of the year before.

Yeah, which isn't a surprise to

me.

I mean who has given his

Factory.

Yeah.

You know.

Whatever.

But anyway.

He Factory.

There's a lot of factories that

could be the fact of the year,

every, you know, every right,

right.

So, it isn't so much that, hey,

we finally got recognized or

this is our year.

It was this has been a really

tough year, right?

My very first thought

immediately was hey, get the get

to get the team together and let

them know that they won this

award.

It wasn't.

Oh, man, me and Mike, are

kicking ass, right?

I find.

It was literally, my first

thought was tell the people that

put in the work every fucking

day.

My first thought was awesome

that they are getting

recognized.

Yeah, because this has been a

tough year and, you know, just

having people on the outside say

So we got everybody together and

we said, look, I said look, let

me explain this to you, how this

works.

This is a publication.

Some people think it's just as

relevant as a Cigar Aficionado.

It's a more one that they all

know about more relevant.

Yeah, I said, but to me it's

irrelevant.

I look at it every, you know,

every day or two, right.

And I said what they're saying

is That have all the factories

in the world that they look at

cigars, it isn't just that our

cigars are good, they're

recognizing that consistency and

all these things that we talked

about, they are right, you know,

I didn't, I didn't promote us

for this.

I didn't ask them to recognize

us just randomly.

They said, this is the best

Factory for the whole year.

Yeah.

Right.

And what they're saying is that

As a group it's like we were

saying about football.

It's like, Philadelphia may have

been the best team this year,

but but Kansas city has the best

program, right?

It's like Alabama, may not have

the best team every year, but

Alabama has the best college

football program.

Yeah.

Right.

And so what they're saying is

that the factory has the best

program that we had that we're

doing things the right way.

We have done it this way.

For years.

We're putting good products out

there, they're consistent,

they're good value Etc.

And they're recognizing them,

right?

And so then they have this

fucking, you know, asshole come

on there, which it was somebody

in the business.

I don't know who it was because

they knew they know, they know a

lot of stuff that's going on.

Yeah, so they say well, you know

what a joke, it's unimpressive

that I was like look you know,

whatever first of all, you're

making this about me, right?

And it's not a bet never.

Since since, since I heard about

this three hours ago was this

ever about me, it was a it's

always my first two minutes

after we found out.

There's a photo Go on Instagram

telling the team about the word

that they want, right?

And that's not false humility.

That's just how we looked at it.

And so you have these kinds of

things and then you have you

see?

And we understand why if you buy

a cigar from a factory and you

only go down three or four times

a year just to sit down and in a

room and be the big shot for the

week.

Yeah.

And someone else is doing all

this hard stuff, that, that

we've had to do, right?

Investing millions of dollars in

raw material.

Making sure you don't get bugs,

making sure you don't have mold,

make sure you don't over

humidify under or ferment under

ferment, making sure that your

people are taking care of.

Yeah.

In the middle of a mass Exodus

to the Border, making sure the

people who need to go Can go,

right?

And that's another piece.

If people have been with you for

years, it's their time, right?

They've been making cigars for

20 years.

This is their shot.

They got to go.

And so how do you help them do

that.

Yep.

Not not sit back and bitch at

him, right?

There's all those pieces and and

then so, so then that same

person can turn around and sell

cigars for for five dollars,

more three dollars more and then

they say, well you can't make a

good cigar for less than

fourteen dollars, right?

Because you know anybody at

selling cigars for nine dollars

is Kitty, cigars like no matter

what?

They tell you, they're not using

good material, a psych, hold the

fuck up.

We actually pay more from labor.

We pay more for material, we pay

more for packaging, materials we

pay, we pay more for all that

stuff.

We make our Factory for all

intensive.

Purposes is a non-profit.

We covered this.

Last time, we make almost no, we

sink money into the factory

because where we make our money

is on the US side because we

only have three employees,

because we don't have sales

people, we don't do marketing,

we're very, very efficient,

right?

On this side.

So we do well as a company, 20

points of margin 25 over of

income, 25 points that's as good

as any company out there.

Karen Tina it's better than STG.

It's better than all drop.

The evidence in front of fucking

always be able to yeah it's

better than all those kids

better than the best ever in the

industry.

It is the it actually is the

best evidence, the industry

shows right groans.

Probably better because

Padrone's, probably better.

Yeah, he doesn't like it.

But if we, if we're comparing

We're having a conversation in

Padrone's.

The only one, the only ones that

we could mention, I mean shit.

Yeah, that's not bad.

Pretty fucking good, you know, I

don't know that it didn't have

Drop.

That's pretty high.

It's got to decide what shape

that was dope.

It's going to change your

numbers, you know.

Yeah, yeah.

The point, the point of all that

is to say that's where I would

call my can you believe these

motherfuckers?

Can you guys like, dude, relax?

Because I know I appreciate it.

I know what it takes.

I know what you do every day.

I mean, you know, me and Arlen

getting in a car.

Are in San Juan at three in the

morning.

Or multiple times Harlan gets in

the car at 3:00 or 4:00 in the

morning, gets to S Elite 8 in

the morning works for 45 hours

and gets back for fear wrote to

get fiorella dinner, right?

And it's a 5-hour trip both

ways, but she's got to go up

inside and check.

So she's got to go up and fix an

issue or she's got a you know,

or I do that or we go sleep in a

shitty bed in Los Arcos for a

month while we're dealing with

every bullshit thing.

Yeah it's like I'm not, I'm not

saying I'm a master blender.

I'm not saying, but I'm a cigar

maker right in.

And that means something we

selected, the tobacco, we paid

for it with our own money.

We touch it.

We deal with today.

Our production managers

grandfather died, we deal with

that directly, right, right.

We're shut down the factors

afternoon.

Why?

Because his grandfather's

funeral is more important,

right?

And a half a day production,

we're going to shut down the

whole faculty, take care of your

people.

Exactly.

We do that.

We do that every day.

Are you the at the end of the

day?

Are you a good fucking person?

We driving we try?

Yeah.

And so the thing is, is when I

don't expect to be patted on the

back for that, but you know,

Spencer.

He's passed out either.

Yeah, whatever the fuck I was

characterized as dude.

You have no idea.

I work, two, three, four, five

in the morning.

I work 20 hours a day 7 days a

week.

Yeah.

In one form, or another Arlen

starts, getting phone calls and

texts at 7:00 in the morning.

It doesn't stop until 7:00 at

night.

So, and you reap the fruits of

that labor of all that hard

work.

We're doing good.

Yeah, we're doing good.

And I don't, that's another

thing that for fucking people to

hate.

So go, you can't, you know?

Yeah.

Well it must be nice to have all

the watches.

It fucking is.

It's your fucking in.

Yeah.

Again, if we figured out a way

to come up with a cigar that

retails in the market, anywhere

between eight to twelve dollars,

right?

The consumer wins.

Yeah, right.

And if we figured out a way to

make money on that and put out a

fucking great product, That's

rated as well as they are.

All right, then then why are

people bitching?

You know what I mean?

Like it's win-win.

Oh, it's part of its jealousy in

part of its just, you know, hey

you know what though listen you

can.

What's the saying you can gauge?

How successful You Are by the

fucking amount of haters that

you have and shit like that.

That's really a thing.

It is really don't need my can

tell you I don't need the Pat's

on the back.

It's like, hey he's not, he's

not that kind of guy.

He doesn't need external.

Oh, but I do it's like just

Generally, it's like this.

Look at this, look at the real.

The problem is, is the people

saying this don't even really

unhappy.

No fucking idea what's going on

yet.

Not you know what the closest

coming to the Dominican.

Like all the guys that came out

that had other factories that

came over.

They all man, I love what you

guys do.

I let you know what I mean?

Like that shit right there.

Like that actually goes a lot

further.

Like that's that's the that's

the real deal.

Those are the people that are in

it, you know your lies, right?

And it's like the street cred,

among your peers.

Yeah, right.

And it goes both ways, right?

It's not just like, hey, look at

us.

It's really, it goes, I dude,

I'm in all, you know, I mean,

you see these guys, you know,

it's like it's smoking cigars

since I was forgetting, you

know, 20-something years old,

right?

So, so it goes both ways.

But whenever you're kind of

brought in at that, we sit at

the same table, but you have a

place at the table like that,

that means something.

Well, there's only a few people

who really live in Nicaragua,

right?

And there was only a few people

who have long periods of time

and esteli working to build

their own thing.

I'll give you an example, James

and Angela Brown at oveja.

Negra When we built our Factory,

I was proud of it but I knew it

wasn't really what I really

wanted to do.

And then when they got this

space that they got their new

Factory and they started doing

all their own design and

everything there and I was like

oh man that's so cool right?

I remember telling Mike I'm like

dude there I love what they're

doing over there the way they're

taking care of their people.

The way they're doing small but

they're doing you know like

people say oh you copied black

you copied black label on this

thing and I'm like first of all

when you're talking Like multi

rapper barber poles the way that

they get it almost near perfect

but if you look at our

sabertooths and our Black Irish,

they're not beautiful.

They're, they're tasty.

I think the debate.

I like it better than other

cigars but they're not.

They're not in here as perfect.

In terms is aesthetically

artistically.

Perfect as what is what's a

James and Angela do in my

opinion.

So I don't even view myself as a

cop.

Being or make, you know, I

didn't even any of this.

You know, everything we need to

do things copied right now, but

I remember when they moved, I've

always had respect for them

because they're there.

They eat in the same restaurants

is us.

They buy groceries in the

grocery store.

They're not tourist.

Right?

You know, they're actually

they're doing it and I believe

me, if anyone understands what

that means, and the sacrifices

you're making, so when they,

when they moved to San Juan

because so their son could go to

a better school Kind of in the

back of my head, kind of, in a

kind of a hater way.

My first, my first thing, every

time I saw their picture with

her big dog and on the patio and

the swimming pool and I'm like,

well, you should take some

really nice photos like, oh, but

you guys used to be in the

trenches with me, but now,

you're just now you're a

tourist.

They left me right now.

You're living the line.

Every time I would see those

pictures.

I would be like, oh, that's

really cool.

Good for them, because I know

how hard it was on them.

Right to it, dude.

Right.

And so but then at the same

time, I'm like, but I'm Still a

real cigar maker.

I'm still here right?

You know in a way yeah I guess

in the back of my mind, right?

And then so finally we go down

and we're just looking at

property to buy because the

conversation was We want to buy

a house, doesn't make sense to

buy a house in Italy because

it's all over priced and there's

nobody to buy it when you want

to sell it right?

But San Juans.

Good good it's a good investment

real estate investment property

Mike and I are looking for some

Investments.

We go down there, we stay there

for a weekend in July we find

this house boom, you know, 500

your whatever, you know, by the

haps by the house, the house

cache of monkeys, forgot to

write.

We have monkeys in the backyard.

So then so then we're like he

does is bitch about the monkeys

coming.

He's the Bad.

Monkey is monkeys are amazing.

Now they're fucking problem.

You need the big dog eat the

monkey.

Got to get the big dog.

I'm just I'm just not I just

think I'm just afraid one of

those monkeys gonna jump over

the thing and tear, somebody's

skull off and then I'm like,

okay, right, that's all I would

start so filters on high.

But now that I'm down there

Switch to a different camera

phone.

And I'm giving you this to say,

actually, your headphones

thinking, no certain way is easy

to do because I was thinking

that way and and the back of my

mind, but actually being down

there and understanding how they

come up every week to do

payroll.

How one of them every week is up

there?

But they're really just

sacrifice.

It's really a sacrificed or make

it right, because you get it up

more time.

So their kid can be in a good

school, right?

And I'm like, okay, now that I'm

living that right now, I get it,

I understand it.

It is way having a tartar, you,

you saw her.

House in Italy.

It was be comfortable with nice

nice.

But it's watch many episodes of

soprano.

Yeah, so Noble.

So now understanding having to

travel and do all that stuff

now, you're like, okay, now I

get it.

Yeah, but the options down there

for everything it's just like

10x more like yeah.

The quality of life is better

but it actually makes running

the factory a lot harder, right?

And so the sacrifices you make

your kids point is but all

right, but had covid-19 to

happen and you guys didn't spend

that nine months in the states

and in Again you have this

illusion that things are kind of

working the way that they're

working.

That Conversation Piece would

have never really come up.

As far as is this an option to

do it down here, right to buy a

house and to kind of have this

house in San Juan, right?

And at the time was like, no,

because that was before

November, right?

You're talking about the July

before the November.

So it's like, yeah, we can do

this.

And, you know, again, we've we

have done it.

So we need a helicopter, you,

and James.

You pull for helicopter?

We should.

We should Yes, it's don't push

it like Kobe.

If it's not the booth booth has

a nice helicopter.

Flying conditions are not good.

You cannot fly.

Yeah.

But what's the point of all that

is to say that you know until

you walk a mile in someone

else's shoes.

And in this industry, people

saying that they do this or they

do that.

They don't really do that.

It's hard to filter out that

stuff.

But what I can tell, the point

of it is to say this has been a

tough year for us.

We really needed a week.

Yeah, in Florida.

And here we are.

And here we go.

So Mike has the Visa so horny.

Yes, yes.

I do want to say that for the

patreon, I don't know how good

is the story.

Do we have, like, any more dirt

for the patron?

I don't know.

I mean, he almost was in tears.

Well, where we on time?

I mean, hour and a half.

So we got 30, we could make this

into a two-parter.

It's always a two-parter needs

to be the first martyr was the

wedding and I think three parter

sometimes.

Yeah.

The first the first 45 minutes

was away his wedding shit.

Hmm, we can save it for the

patreon if you want.

Anything fun and exciting

happened in the news and we news

recording that you have stuff.

Yeah.

We have a quick fat.

It'll be part two.

We'll just cut it out and put it

16.

Put your camera on Phil.

Oh yeah.

Hello people.

All right, so I have a question

for all you guys.

What is the oldest cigar that

you've ever smoked when go

online all this exists?

I smoked a Davidoff dump, Aaron

Yan, that was like, suppose, you

know, pre it was probably 25

years old.

The padrone Millennium probably

is yeah.

I would say the same with the

millenniums.

What I went to So there was a

shop in Austin Texas called

Heroes and Legacies remember

Richards place.

He had some pre embargo cigars

back in his cabinet that we had

broke out.

That allegedly were pretty

embargo cigars that he bought at

an auction that so, yeah, they

have no flavor.

Yeah, then, you know, for sure

that riparian but I would say

back then my pilot was not

nearly as sophisticated as you

know, so it could have been good

with anything.

You wouldn't the role special,

all right?

All right.

Right?

It was that your fun fact?

No, no.

Fucking a random question.

Well, it goes with going to tell

us what the old cigar Dinger

Estate One Time.

Say they made a cigar with

million million year old tobacco

million-year-old.

It was like, it was like a joke

in one other has like made with

a million euro age 41 million

years or something.

So in April 2012, archaeologists

from trampled, University

uncovered, seal, clay pots

whilst working in southeast

Guatemala, bleed to be

pre-columbian.

Jars, contain 800 cigars, A

Closer examination as the guards

revealed that the conditions

they had been stored in meant

that they were still smokable.

And they ended up being sold at

auction for a staggering five

hundred, and seven thousand

dollars.

Wow.

And right now they're available

at CI for half the price credit

if that had been observing

actually redeemed yourself

there.

The cabinet somewhere Corona,

right?

Little speak that 100%.

Well, the biggest news, Michael

is that we are the number one

podcast.

That is some big news.

Investing, our podcast from

thousands of pod, guys on the

web and ranked by traffic social

media followers, domain

Authority, and freshness.

I heard Coupe demanded an

asterisk.

You put on this.

Yeah, you know that if you if

you click down further as a

separate list that comes up,

that shows podcast people or

something like that.

That and he's number one on

that.

Yeah, you know you have the best

program but just not the best

team.

You know what?

At the end of the day, right?

Okay, we'll go with that.

I'll take, I'll take the best

program.

Why can't you just have your

flowers?

Yeah you know I mean one can't

yeah give me give me give me one

Victory lap.

You know this is really for Mike

Mike.

Yeah.

Mike needed this 100%.

I just check it I don't even

know how to be weary night so I

mean it just came out.

I just happen to Google it,

looking for something else,

that's a big deal.

That was it was last year.

We got number two.

I mean, you have work at an

official.

I mean, so that that's probably

what put, you know, we have the

nicest room, but I mean this, I

could tell you here, we

consistently show up.

We consistently show up were

100% authentic.

It's like being a dad.

Yeah.

And and there's there is an ad

space in every single fucking

thing that we do, you know.

And that's unfortunately that

sucks to us because it is

there's no Financial benefit but

because of it, we're number one.

So, you know, I mean Iris we

respect and anything much.

From listening to us but we are

very entertaining.

I think that you actually learn

Show Notes

The second half of the Roma Craft Interview with Michael Rosales and Skip Martin