Episode 66 Skip Martin Roma Craft Tobacco Part 1

Episode Summary

Part one of a three-part sit-down with Skip Martin, co-founder of RoMa Craft Tobac, recorded at Cigar Hustler after Skip flew in from Nicaragua to attend Senator Marco Rubio's Senate field hearing on premium cigars in Florida. Skip explains why the hearing mattered — testimony has to be entered into the government record before a bill exempting premium cigars from FDA regulation can be argued on its merits — and vents about industry apathy, petition fatigue, and retailers who won't support the CRA, the IPCPR trade show, or their own business interests.

The conversation then goes deep on Skip himself: a Navy nuke and engineering watch supervisor aboard the USS Key West, a resume that runs from a hog farm at Cal Farley's Boys Ranch to Dell supply chain and M&A work, and finally to opening a cigar store, blogging, and building a factory in Estelí. He talks candidly about five-plus years living full-time in Nicaragua — the daughter who totaled the family Ford Explorer into a house (a roughly $30,000 saga), three attempted muggings, and why Estelí is a place of crimes of opportunity rather than violence. He also covers how he uses social media as a community member rather than a brand owner, the Austin house he shares with Mike Rosales, and staffing changes including John Oliver joining from Zycar.

The back half is the cigar business talk enthusiasts come for. Skip breaks down why 2019's store exclusives exist — CraftCraft 2019, Witchcraft for Tobacology, and the Don Bosco for Gary Pesch's Old Virginia Tobacco Company, where factory-level profits plus a dollar per cigar from the retailer go to the Don Bosco church youth program in Estelí. A bad U.S. Connecticut broadleaf crop cut Cro-Magnon production roughly in half, which freed capacity for Whiskey Rebellion going national, the Weaselito, the new Guayabo/Guaymaro size, Wunder|Lust-style one-offs, and the War Bear. He also details the origin of Baka, a Cameroon-wrapped project born from a friendship with Jack Torano and a planned homage to the Torano 1916 Cameroon, and the anthropological naming logic behind Cro-Magnon, Neanderthal and Baka. Along the way: Esteban Disla's legendary blend binder, the history of Fidel Olivas and Latin Cigar, and an affectionate, unsparing read on Steve Saka and Sin Compromiso.

In This Episode

1. 01
   The Marco Rubio Senate field hearing
   Why Skip flew from Nicaragua to attend, how testimony enters the government record, and his frustration at the thin retailer turnout.
2. 02
   Industry apathy, the CRA and IPCPR
   Petition fatigue, who actually funds the fight, and what retailers and manufacturers owe the business.
3. 03
   Navy, submarines and a Forrest Gump resume
   Skip on the USS Key West as a nuke and engineering watch supervisor, plus the odd-job path from a hog farm to Dell to owning a cigar factory.
4. 04
   Life as a gringo in Esteli
   Five years living full-time in Nicaragua, the totaled Explorer, three attempted muggings, and why Esteli is safer than it sounds.
5. 05
   Social media, family and the Austin house
   How Skip engages online as a community member rather than a marketer, and the daily rhythm of factory life and three-hour dinners.
6. 06
   2019 store exclusives and the Don Bosco charity cigar
   CraftCraft 2019, Witchcraft for Tobacology, and the Don Bosco for Old Virginia Tobacco Company, with proceeds going to a church youth program in Esteli.
7. 07
   The broadleaf shortage and the 2019 release slate
   Why Cro-Magnon production is down roughly half and how that opened room for Whiskey Rebellion, the Weaselito, a new Guaymaro size and the War Bear.
8. 08
   Baka: blending with African Cameroon
   How a Jack Torano friendship and the Torano 1916 Cameroon led to RoMa Craft's first Cameroon-wrapped blend, and the anthropology behind the name.

Brands & Cigars Discussed

Linked items are in our shop. Mentions without a link aren’t currently stocked or couldn’t be matched with confidence.

Transcript

Okay, we have been trying to get this interview for over a year now. Sit back, get ready. Here's episode 66, part one of three of the Skip Martin Chronicles. Mike, Mike, Mike, Mike, Mike, Mike, Mike Squared, Squared, Squared.

Well, it's really almost an act of Congress to get Skip here. This is a Skip Martin's Podcast. Skip Martin Podcast. It's not even a Cigar Hustlers Podcast anymore.

No, with Mike and Mike as the guest. I'm the original Cigar Hustler. It's like when Howard Stern finally got Eddie Murphy into the fucking radio show. Like this is the moment.

He just went crazy. The difference is that Eddie Murphy's interview sucked. And we're just not even gonna have to talk for like the next eight hours. That's right.

We just turned it on. Hope there's enough memory left on the computer. My 1972 Apple computer. I was gonna throw a jab.

Are we live? Yeah, so it is 10:47 Eastern Daylight Savings Time. Yes, it is. In the evening.

You're going for the record? I don't even have to try to hit the record. He's not even going to try. We're going to cover a lot of ground here, Mike.

All right. Try to keep up. Who are we going to try to get now, now that Skip has been here? That's it.

We're done. We just shut it down. The show's over. That's it.

The show's done. Well, this is episode 65. Right, so like, first of all, I had to get you guys to like, shake off the rookie cobwebs. Right.

I can't just appear on, I mean, if I'd appeared on episode three or something, you'd have forgotten me, like, the fucking David Blanco episode or something. I mean, how many people have gone back and listened to that one? Oh, man, I don't know, I haven't had anybody comment about that one, to be honest. Nope.

Nobody's really said, hey, you know, that Blanco was a fucking amazing. Not even in the top of my brother, tomorrow. You know? Yep.

So. And we have, you know, we still have our guests in the room. We have Miss Brittany, Jeffrey, and the ever so quiet Arlen is in the room as well, but she's not speaking, she spends a lot more, you know the only thing more boring than a two hour long congressional field hearing? Is a five hour podcast?

Is a two hour long congressional field hearing in a language you don't understand. Yeah, no shit. No shit. Yeah, so that was interesting today, I mean, I watched it from afar via Facebook.

So. I thought it was interesting. I was a little disappointed that more people didn't show up. I mean, imagine how many retailers within driving distance could have come to that and didn't.

Yeah. I mean, that's really the biggest... That was the most disappointing part of the whole hearing that there weren't more industry people there, you would think. Yeah, the biggest problem in our industry, I think, is just this intrinsic apathy.

Right. So, in all areas, you guys talk about that on a weekly basis, but... Originally, as part of the boutique cigar association thing that I'm in, we were invited and then they told us not to come. That it was going to be a smaller venue than they had originally planned.

I think a lot of people only wanted to come if they could talk. Probably, yeah. And I don't know if people wanted to come just to listen. But it was, I mean, look, I flew all the way from Nicaragua to attend it, so I found it extremely valuable.

I mean, it's the very first time that I've heard an actual politician talk about our industry in a way that reflects at least a basic understanding of our industry. Right. Do you think at all he was doing it just to say he did it? No, not at all.

No? I mean, you know, I'm not a far right wing Republican, as you know, and I was really impressed not only by his genuine interest, I mean, he was really seeking to do a better job of understanding. But the biggest purpose of the meeting, more than anything, was the way our government works is something has to be in the government record for it to be officially considered by people in the government. So if Marco Rubio is going around trying to promote Senate Bill No.

9, which has a long-ass, ridiculous name, but basically it's exempt premium cigars from FDA regulation, if he wants to go around to his peers and to talk about that, He has to be able to refer to evidence and facts and testimony that are actually in the record. Okay, so it's like a fact-finding mission for him. That's why this wasn't just Marco Rubio shooting the breeze, this was an actual Senate-filled hearing. Right.

It had the same kind of force of law as a hearing that you see on TV, you know, where they're asking the five-minute questions or whatever. So here's the problem, right? And this is one of the many reasons why I fucking despise some of the people in this industry, like 80% of the retailers. But for one, how many fucking posts have you seen in the past five years of, hey, you need to sign here to save this fucking bill?

Right. So, like, at this point, everybody's fucking totally numb to it. Right. Sign here now.

Like, okay. Like the boy who cried wolf. Right. For fucking what?

Right. " Just like I've done for the past five years. Been there, done that, nothing else has happened. And the second thing is that there was no, I mean, I don't think, you know, I'm not a big believer in some of the representatives of our organization because of the fact that, you know, nobody fucking said, "Hey, this is a big deal.

" Right? Or any of, to that degree, whatsoever in the certain, nobody's fucking- Yeah, but we're all grown-ups. Sure. You're responsible for understanding your business and understanding that this was a critical thing, so- But how could you know that it was a critical thing when you've heard so many things before?

I mean, I knew. I can't speak for you, I can't speak- But would you consider yourself the average fucking manufacturer or brand owner or even like a retailer? You know, I mean? No, I'm not average.

Right. I mean, I don't really know how to answer that. You know, here's the thing. You didn't have to be there to get the information.

Right. And the fact that people weren't there, I don't think in this, there's no camera on the crowd. There's no indication. How big was the crowd?

Was it half full, quarter full? There was probably 40 or 50 people there. Surprisingly, there was no anti people there, which I kind of expected. But, I mean, it was interesting.

Like I said, I feel the way you do. I feel the way you do. Sign another petition, blah, blah, blah, call your congressman, blah, blah, blah. We're a grassroots organization.

We're gonna save the world. Yeah, I mean, it's like, right? That's the problem. Like the group that went up and they all smoked outside the Capitol.

That didn't really seem to accomplish much. Yeah, so, look, here's the thing. Is the Cigar Rights of America perfect in an organization? No.

Not even close. Right. If you're a guy who spends $30 a month on cigars, should you spend So if you spend $30 once a year to join the CRA, yes you should, if you're a retailer, should you figure out how to, even if you have to shut your store down for three days, how to fly out to the IPCPR to get re-energized about the business and contribute to the trade show and make sure that does the majority of our fighting, yes. But if you're a larger manufacturer, should you contribute a significant amount of money and participate?

Yes. That's how the world works. Right. And so, I spent, look, I'm not a big fan of this part of Florida.

I spent time here when I was in the Navy. You're not? I don't, you know, look, for me to come to Florida, I have to get up at 3:30 in the morning. I have to drive.

I have to drive, I have to leave my two and a half year old, I have to drive, which is basically like taking my life in my hands, driving from Esteli to Managua every time it happens. Right. Riding with you it is. And then I have to wait on an airplane, go through all the bullshit, fly to Houston, wait for three hours, and then fly somewhere here to Tampa.

I think we left at 3:30 in the morning, we got here at midnight the next night. Right. So, look, that's not how I like to spend a day of my life. Right.

It was worth, I mean, it cost two, three thousand dollars, at least, for airplane tickets. It cost, you know, who knows, for the rental car and all that. I just think that you were overly excited. You're like, you know what?

I think you woke up one morning and you said, "I'm gonna get on this fucking podcast. " Finally, I'm gonna be close enough. And then he said, "Oh shit, Marco Rubio's talking too about something. " No, really, I was just sick of eating Gallo Pinto.

Right, I was just sick of eating Gallo Pinto. Fuck it, you know. I want to go see Mickey Mouse or something. So here you are.

So here I am. So what are we going to talk about, Skip? If you don't have a long list of questions, this is going to be a very painful five hours. You think so?

It's going to be a long day. I mean, so like, here's the thing, I mean, if you've listened to this podcast, you know that this podcast isn't your standard "hey", you know, fucking cigar this, cigar that, da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. Cigar tastes like Rice Krispies. Yeah, you're seeing regurgitated bullshit.

Madagascar Vanilla, and I scored a 94. Right. Must buy a box. Well, every podcast I'm on is not like that anyway.

I don't do the origin story. I don't do the... Well, what normally happens is you just kind of take over the show. Tasting notes.

Right. What was that last one we saw him on where he took over the show? Was that Coop? He was on Coops.

Coop. And he brought props. You know? And Hector Alfonso as one of those cigars was really upset about that.

He fucking brought props. Are you kidding me? Who does that? I was loaded by the time that show ended.

He had maps and charts. Soaps and graphs. No, they did a, you know, they always review our cigars and do a top 10 at the end of the year. Right.

I did my top 10, or my top 20 cigar blogs of 2018. Right. Had them all on a piece of paper. Yeah.

He reviewed them all. I mean, in essence, Halfway was number one. I mean, this is the only really realistic source that I use for anything news-related. Was Charlie there today?

Was somebody from Half-Wheel there? No, Charlie wasn't there, but he did check in with me, and they actually ended up broadcasting, and so I'm sure they're going to do their own piece on it, but... Okay. All right.

I mean, so all my questions, everything that I want to kind of pull out of you is just, you know, personal shit that I know about you. Let's talk about it. You don't know half of the shit about me. Well, you're right, you're right, you know, because you've lived like several lives.

I'm surprised you're not 75 years old. My heart's 75. Just ask my cardiologist. So, one of the greatest stories that you've ever told me, and I hope that you give it everything that I've experienced in the past on the show, is a story about you being in the submarine in the USS Key West.

I was on the USS Key West and I was an ELT, an Injuring Watch Supervisor. Right. So there's two major stories that you've told me when you're on in the submarine. All right, one is when you were locked into a room and shit hit the fan, right?

Yeah, when we, when the whole, the whole Injuring Middle Level blew up. I'd like you to tell that story. And caught on fire. Yeah.

Well, you just told it. That was a good story. Good story, Skip. Thanks, Joe.

No, there's more to this than that. I feel like you're not drunk enough, you know, 'cause like you go into way more detail. I'm drinking. I'm on like these 14 to 18 percent stouts.

I want to hear the story about when he was in submarine training the first day he got there and got hammered. I never went to submarine training 'cause I was a nuke, so we didn't go to submarine school. Right. Oh, you're talking about when I went to my C school in New London.

That's the one. And I woke up on the golf course in a pool of vomit. Frozen to the ground? Yes.

Frozen to the ground? Well, I appreciate you giving the actual details of these stories and I'm just kind of skimming through them. I mean, sea stories are, I don't know if they convey as well on podcasts, there was the time where we were running a whole torpedo tube full of rum. That was the other story I wanted to tell you.

Yeah, you'll have to catch me at an event for one of those sea stories. Get the fuck out of here! You gotta tell the Bacardi story. Um, it's a long story.

We got time, plenty of time. We've got five hours. Nothing else going on right now. I'm going for the World Record.

I don't want to tell these stories. We're only 12 minutes into our five-hour podcast. It's becoming the Eddie Murphy thing. He's not going to talk.

Now he's not going to talk. He's going to lock up, and it's just going to be you and me talking. " I'm like, "Yeah, I do have questions. " I mean, you let Caldwell get away with, "Oh yeah, I was abducted in Africa," and whatever.

Oh, I'll tell you that next time. Yeah, so like, here's the thing. I haven't slept at Caldwell's house. I thought you said you slept with Caldwell.

I don't have the relationship with Caldwell that I have with you. I mean, I've slept with him. Oh, okay. It's true.

So, I'll say this. I think just about all the guys here have slept with him. So, I told you if I ever came on to the show that I would start with, I was born a poor black child. Right.

Because I really was. So we can get in later about my youth, but I have been everything from, in terms of jobs, my very first job was emptying trash bags at a car wash, which I parlayed into a marinating chicken at a fried chicken fast food restaurant. I can see the connection there. Which I parlayed into being the cashier at that restaurant, which I parlayed to working at a framing shop.

in the mall. Right. Then I took a hiatus to Cal Farley's Boys Ranch where I worked in a hog farm. Right.

Raised pigs. Shoveled chicken shit for every morning at four in the morning. Moved irrigation through hay. Did a roundup for cattle on a horseback.

Right. Cutting nuts and, you know, sleeping out in the range. Out of the stars. Believe it or not, north of Amarillo.

Eating beans. Yes. To being one of the best baseball players in the state of Texas. To going to college.

In college, I worked a number of different jobs. went into the Navy, was on a submarine in the Navy, got out of the Navy, did my own business, which I sold, a tech thing, and then did financial services, everything from insurance to treasury management. I ordered a seat on the Board of Trade. I did debt collections for a little while.

I started at Dell in the call center as a sales guy selling part-time while I was in school selling what are now archaic computers to American Airlines employees as an employee purchase thing to doing their call center planning to doing facilities worldwide to doing supply chain management worldwide to doing mergers and acquisitions worldwide to starting a cigar store. starting a cigar being a cigar blogger starting a cigar brand opening a cigar factory taking over podcasts as a guest host commandeering podcasts mentoring struggling retailers mentoring people as a whole I've been it's a little Forrest Gumpish I've done a lot of things and you still don't want to tell us about the Bacardi story I'll have to tell, I'll tell, I'll tell, that's one I have to save face-to-face. Jeez Louise. Okay, so, um, I gotta tell.

That involves national security. Such bullshit. Such bullshit. So, um, you know, the one thing that really kind of disappointed me in our last trip is that, um, we didn't get to eat at Fincasu Mesa, right?

We didn't make chili this time either, I don't think. You didn't go on your city-wide search for Fritos. No, we did not. Did we bring Fritos this time?

Yeah, you brought Fritos this time, but it was nice and fun. Not the right ones, I don't think. So, ooh, I got a funny story to tell you. So, now that enough time has passed, the first time in our adventure, and Danny, I'm really sorry about this, When we were out looking for Fritos, and Danny was driving the car, we had a little run in with a fucking median, and we fucking went boom, boom, boom, boom, right over the front.

In my car? In the Explorer, yeah. That's all right, Arlen's daughter, Patricia, has since totaled that one. Since it's totally wrecked, and I know that he can't get in trouble for it, it's, you know, that was, when it had happened, like, it was total quiet in the car, I was like, bro, I ain't saying a fucking thing, don't worry.

That's a pretty interesting story, which I can tell, so we're flying to enter Tobac, we're going about a week ahead of time, because we're going to Madrid for a week, so Arlene could go to the embassy, they renew her visa, and Arlene gets to the airport in Managua, and she gets a phone call that her 17-year-old daughter has taken the truck from our house and hit another, had an accident, that's all we knew at that point. point so arlen's like i'm not sure if i want to get back because arlen was flying from monagua to panama to spain i was flying from austin to spain and so she messages me um patricia has totaled the car basically i'm like okay what and then of course it was you know radio blackout for 18 hours and i'm like what you know is she okay is she dead like i have no idea what happened so as the story developed apparently what happens she's decided that she's going to take the car the three blocks to school right she's uh only driven with me once it's wasn't pretty she's decided she's going to take the car by herself she hits a truck on the way to school um and then on the way back from school she dodges a vehicle and runs into a house so so now i'm you know of course she's so i'm I'm getting like text from SLE of the news, it's actually on the news, of the truck, and somebody's going to run into the house. Yeah, kind of a big deal on SLE, right? Yeah, I mean, everybody in SLE knows.

So, okay, so before you get even further into the story, what kind of car was it? A Ford Explorer. Okay, how common is that car in SLE? The only one.

Well, I think AJ used to have one, and then we had one. Okay. Couldn't buy a high looks, could you? Well, the Japanese don't buy cigars.

Okay, so, the car fuckin' wrecks into a house, right? Well, it doesn't just do it. Right. Someone is driving.

Right. Which is awesome. Right. And, like, what's even cool for me is, like, as much correspondence as we have when you're in Nicaragua and stuff, like, I don't even, I don't know the shit, I don't know anything that's going on outside of, like, factoring bullshit and, like, back and forth until you, like, land.

" So, go ahead. Yeah, so, so, there's a whole long series of events. The short version is, um, the girl that was in the car, her mother got involved somehow, so we had to settle that out. Then, um, we had to basically negotiate and pay to rebuild that part of the house that got crushed.

Then we had to basically keep it a non-legal matter, if you know what I'm saying, a non-police matter, and then we had to take care of the other truck, the first vehicle that was hit, and then we had to get our car to Managua, which started, this happened in October, and literally the car is still in the body shop. Yeah, because they don't know what the fuck to do. There was about, well first of all, there was like four months of negotiating with the insurance company. Right, which was the next question I was going to get to.

Yeah, and so basically this whole thing has cost me about $30,000. Oof. I mean, if you think about it, for a house and a car, that's not too bad. You know, if you pull into a fucking house in the United States, you're not smashing a $30,000 house, I can tell you that much.

Yeah, so that's an ongoing situation. The struggle is real. It's real. But, you know, that's the news story.

Right. We've made the news. Does the news continue to update on the situation? No.

Or has it died down? Yeah, there's been dead bodies since then. Right, so, you know, you're just hoping for more rage and chaos. But this was like right in the middle of, you know, the blockades and the riots in the streets, and so this was like, you know.

Right. Just like a blip. A little fun news story. Right.

And in other news. The gringo. Skip Burns, Curry. Because you know, as many people, as you would think, spend a lot of time in Esteli, based on their blending and everything else, but there's really, you know, there's...

Which is horseshit, that's what you're trying to say, but go ahead. So I live there. How long have you lived in Nicaragua? Five years, full-time, going on six.

There's James Brown, and James and Angela, and I'm super jealous of this, they actually live in San Juan del Sur now. Oh, no shit. And they trade terms coming up to the factory. Oh, that's cool.

So I'm super jealous of that. But really, James and I are the only real kind of gringos that are there on a regular basis. Right. And then there's guys that come in and out, like Hector and Saka and, you know, the Paping family and the Plasensias and those guys.

But in terms of gringos, you know, kind of brand guys, there's really no other gringos there. So it's a really small world. You kind of stick out. Yeah, they know everything that happens.

Right. So, can we talk about attempted muggings? Is that permitted? Sure, we can talk about that.

Okay, so how many times, so in the five year span that you lived in Esteli, how many times have you been attempted to be mugged? Two and a half. Okay. A half.

All right, all right. Well, that's three. There's a story here. Okay, so you want to break down every one of them?

Every one of them? so, you know, I stay up late, I don't know if you know, but... I've heard about that. I usually wake up about 9 or 10 in the morning, and I'll kind of do Facebook and stuff until noon-ish.

Right. I'll eat breakfast when most people eat lunch, and then I'll usually go to bed 5, 6 o'clock in the morning. And, so, back when I first moved to Esteli, I had a little kind of one-bedroom apartment, And I would walk to the factory, you know, midday, and I would stay there, because I didn't have internet at the house, I would stay there and work till three or four in the morning with the security guard, then I would leave, and go back to the apartment. Right.

The first mugging, I guess, is the… Attempted mugging. Attempted mugging, yeah. So at that time, I was kind of a rookie, I was carrying a gun. Right.

Because I didn't know any better. Which could be very… What I've since learned is it's much cheaper to pay someone to carry a gun than it is to carry a gun. " There were these two guys. So I took a left, they started following me.

When I got to the next corner, took a right, they were coming around the first corner. I got to the next corner, took a left. They were coming around the next corner. So I kind of ducked into this little doorway, and they walked past me.

I didn't really speak great Spanish then, but it was pretty clear what was going on. One of them had a rock, and one of them, they were both drunk. And they were like, where did he go, where did he go? So I pulled the gun up behind them and let one off, and they shit their pants and ran.

So that was the only armed engagement. Right. " Right. And that was the end of the gun.

Like, if you'd have shot him. It would have been. We had a guy actually break into our house twice in three days. He climbed into the window once when Patricia was there, and he came in the living room.

She was in the bedroom, he came in the living room, robbed a bunch of stuff in the living room, Dope back out the window, and then like two days later, I'm in the living room, and he comes through the bedroom window, so I grabbed the knife and chased him out the window, and so that was, you know, that was fun, and then we got bars in the window. Right. We should just do something about that, because realistically, what you've always told me is, you know, I mean, I know that we're saying these stories, and this is kind of over a five year span, but SLE isn't really a violent place. It's more of a crime of opportunity, right?

Yeah, you're much more likely to get shot in the United States than you are in SLE, but, you know, if you leave your phone on the table, someone will grab it. Right. The third time was actually probably about a year ago. I was walking from my house to the factory.

I had my computer bag across my shoulder. Right. And these two guys, you know, probably, I don't know, 18, 20-year-old guys on a motorcycle, they both probably weighed less than 130 pounds. Right.

They drove past me. No muffler. " So they drove past, and they started looking back. Then they do a circle around the block, and I could hear them coming back around the block.

So one of them jumps off the back of the motorcycle with a big kitchen knife. Right. " So he goes to put the knife on me, and I throw my bag against his arm and just lift him up and body slam him, like WWE style. And his buddy on the motorcycle took off.

So I'm standing there with my foot on the knife, and this, you know, 110-pound, you know, paint-huffing kind of knucklehead. And he's just, like, shitting his pants. And this old lady comes out of the bodega with a broom and beats the shit out of him. So she, like, hits him for, like, the whole block.

Right, with the brush part of the broom. Yeah, with the broom, yeah. So, yeah, I mean, I outweigh them like three to one. Right.

So, I mean, I'm not saying I'm, you know, street fighter. Right. But it's a pretty safe place. Yeah.

And as long as you got your, I mean, we've walked through the streets at night. Yeah. I always tell you, you know, just keep your head up. Right.

Know who's there. Don't stick your cell phone out. You know, just keep it in your pocket. Right, exactly.

Don't be fucking stupid. Right. Right. There's always one that you forget, though.

There's one that you had one when you were riding your bicycle. I don't remember. " Oh yeah, yeah, but that was kind of, that's not even a half. Right.

That's the... Well, that would be three and a half. That's the thing, you know, it's kind of, they always say, you know, like, 'cause I've spent time in all around the world, like Panama and China and Malaysia and India and Philippines, and really it's just don't make yourself a target. Right.

So... Exactly, so that situation was really more just, you know, come at me bro. Right. Right.

And then he just decided, this guy's got cargo shorts. He's fucking special ops. I'll tell you though, you don't want to get into a fight in flip flops. You're at a strategic disadvantage.

And, you know, plus I only have about eight and a half seconds of good fight in me anyways. So you got to do the WWE slam. You got to go for the juggler in the beginning. You got to make a statement before they realize that you're getting winded.

Right. How many pairs of shoes do you own? Closed-toed shoes. Yeah.

I have a pair of black ones, a pair of brown ones, and a pair of tennis shoes. And how often do you wear them? I have 14 pairs of flip-flops. I have to chime in on this one.

Yes. Because I noticed that he's in closed-toed shoes tonight. Yeah, I checked as soon as he walked into the United States Senator. One of six times this year.

That's just good to see the Senator choose. And I was like, I was shocked to see no flip-flops. Yeah, I would have changed, but... Time was of the essence?

Time was of the essence, yeah. Wow. What's up? Can I say this?

Go ahead. Can I say that I remember the first time I went to Vegas, which was probably two or three years ago? Mm-hmm. And I remember that Skip had lost his flip flops.

Oh, it was my birthday? Yes. Well, first of all, the IPCBR is usually around your birthday. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah. Somebody bought me these, like, ridiculously cheap, girly flip flops. Yeah. And, uh, that was a no-go.

I have pretty high standards for my flip flops. Yeah. Which one? They got, like, the hook on them or whatever the fuck?

What are they called? Olakai. Yeah. So, Arlen's a big fan of the flip flops.

We have a whole, she makes me trade them out. Oh, really? Yeah, she makes me change them, like, you know, those smell bad, let's wash them, change your flip-flops. Right.

It's time to change the flip-flops. Right, so I have eight or nine pairs, the chanclas, and Estelina, I have a few pair in Austin. Okay. So now, like, you recently had a move to have a place in Austin, right?

Mike and I bought a house on the east side of Austin, kind of like an investment and I mean we got sick of buying watches. There's only so many watches you can purchase. Yeah, there's only so many watches you can have. So we bought a house, it's really nice, but that's where I stay.

It's actually my house, but Mike and I own it together. How often do you... He's my boo. He's your boo.

He's my boo, too. But, you know, I mean, this whole new Danny thing. Are you jealous, Mike? You sound a little jealous.

You know, what, between their bromance? Yeah. Nah, I don't know. Because you threw in my boo, too.

You know what it is? It's just that we've kind of lost that love and feeling now that others are involved. Oh, man. I'm jealous of Danny.

Yeah. So, like, Danny and I are kind of building a bromance, but it's like... It's never going to be the same. Yeah, it's just, you know...

Danny's too sensitive. He is. He is. Of all the people who love to give out shit to people, he has the least capacity to take it of anybody I know.

Where have we heard that before? I don't know. Hector. Hector and Jack both.

About Danny, yeah. Hector and Jack both. It's so true. Yeah, he loves to give out shit.

And he's quick with the comebacks. He's fucking smart. He's funny. But then you land one on him, he'll like pout for two hours.

Man, fuck you, man. Fuck you. So, you know, you recently acquired another person, the Frenchie acquisition. John Oliver from Zycar.

So how's he working out? Good. You know, Mike manages that side of the business. I mean, you know, I kind of manage...

Yeah, but like, you still know what the fuck is going on. Oh, of course. To the nth degree. I enter every single day.

I mean, you know, there was a time where you put Koi on blast because you were looking at the cameras and he fell asleep. Fell asleep. Well, you know, that was just kind of a joke. It was really just kind of like a hazing.

And then everybody went fucking nuts. Yeah, but you know, we tried to really make Koi part of the team. Of course. You know, Koi was Mike's decision, hiring decision.

Right. I've probably hired in my life, I've probably hired, I don't know, 5,000, 6,000 people. I've only fired four people in my whole entire life. Right.

I've forced people just to quit and give up, you know, like ring the bell like a Navy SEAL. But I've only fired four who just wouldn't leave. Right. No, seriously, you gotta go.

" You know, and it wasn't because Coy was hired to really be a warehouse guy, and then he wanted to do more, he wanted to get involved in the sales side, he just didn't have the skill set to do it at that point in time. And then, he also missed home, Austin was expensive, I mean, you know, I mean, 27 year olds don't know how to adult, anyway, I mean, he had a constant struggle with laundry, I mean, that's difficult at 27, yeah, but now, you know, he's out on the road, and everything, I mean, he's working for a great company, Black Label, and he's closer to his family, I think he's doing a good job. He called me the other day. I forgot to call him back.

Oh my God. So, call Mike back. He doesn't have your number. How, you know, like, you do a really good job of engaging people on social media, especially Facebook.

Do you have, like, a regimen for that, or do you just kind of wing it, or, you know, how often do you check on your content? I know you said earlier that you check it in the mornings, but... I mean, I'm probably on... I mean, I view it as part of my job.

I mean, I probably do social media, if we added up all the screen time, maybe six hours a day, but I do it from a member of the community perspective, not from a company owner perspective. I do have to like things that people say on our pictures, or do whatever, and that's kind of a company thing, but really I go into other people's posts, And, you know, this guy had a baby, this guy's getting married. Happy Birthdays? Yeah.

Collages. Yeah, I mean, it's really more being part of the community. I don't view it really as work, but it is really work. Right, but you do a good job of, you know, just being a part of the content, right?

And liking and commenting and shit like that. And I think a lot of people don't understand that that's what it takes, right? Yeah, I mean, you could probably go through my posts, and other than me saying, hey, I'm smoking a cigar, and it happens to be mine, I don't really spend a lot of time promoting my own product. Right.

When I'm in the factory during the day, from the first day I was in the factory, and I was like, oh my god, this is so cool, check this out. Right. I still do that kind of stuff, but it's not a promotional thing. Right.

It's more just like, hey, you know, I'm living my life, and this is the coolest thing ever. And, I mean, literally, I mean, I do what I want. I had no idea. I wake up when I want, I go to bed when I want, I smoke what I want, when I want, I buy what I want, when I want.

Yeah, you show up at Cigar Hustler when you want. I'm pretty lucky that way. I'm really jealous of the, every time you post food. Cooking is a big part of our life because, for me, cooking is not a job.

Right. You know, we get home from the factory, and we settle our bags in, we separate the baby from Wani, the nanny, and, you know, spend a little time with her, and then, you know, when we're kind of talking to each other about anything that's not really business-related, we're cutting vegetables, and... Right. I mean, dinner is a three-hour thing pretty much every...

For sure. at the house, so... Absolutely. Yeah.

That's amazing. So we're not going to talk about the USS Key West? All right, so I got a couple touchy ones, too, that I want to kind of address because, like, I know why you've done these things, but I want to get it kind of out for the record, right? Dude, you can ask me whatever you want.

I will always fucking answer. Right, except for what happened on the USS QS. So, this year you got three limiteds coming out, right? Define limited, yeah, go ahead.

Well, so you had three, you know, exclusives coming out, right? You had the Craft 2019. Okay, Jeff. You're right.

You have the Witchcraft. Tobacology. Right. And you have the Don Bosco.

Yeah. Okay. Old Virginia Tobacco Company. Right.

So, what made you decide to release those products solely for those stores? So, it's a combination of factors. And there's a lot of factors, the most, in all three cases, I had, well, in two of the three cases, I had the idea for the product. So the Craft 2019 is a humongous pain in the ass to make.

Right. They can only, a pair of rollers that normally makes 350, 400 cigars a day can only make 100. Right. Um, they have to touch it three or four times, uh, to do it.

Um, we only made, um, um, I think about 4,800 of them, and it probably, probably could have made 25,000 cigars in that period of time. Um, I wanted to, we were definitely gonna do the witchcraft, because when we came out with craft 2018 that had the Candela foot, uh, we did 2013 and 2014. 2013 was like 2,000 boxes. 2014 was 100 boxes for the Cali Mega Herve.

Right. So, I wanted to do a project like that where I wanted to use, because when we were in the blending process for Craft 218, we were going back and forth about whether it should be Candela or Connecticut. Right. And so, I really liked the Connecticut one, we just didn't have enough broadleaf to make another 2,000 boxes, so that's why we decided to make, you know, a couple hundred boxes of that.

And, you know, small retailers, you guys, Jeff, Brett, guys that really support us, but also, you know, having a March, April, May, you know, $20,000 boost of sales doesn't hurt. So that's why we did that project. Right, but it's easy, I mean, you could have just turned any of those brands on to all retailers. Yeah, but then it's like Sabretooth, where you get one box or two boxes.

And I just wanted to make it something where we could actually visit the retailer for the release and, you know, there's just a list of guys I want to do things for, and it's just taken me 10 years to get to some of them. Which was, yeah, and that's kind of what I was kind of getting to, you know, it's like... Old Virginia is a different thing. Old Virginia, Gary Pesch has seven stores.

He's one of these real kind of old-school guys who's really supported us, the TAA guys. And, you know, the Black Irish has always been really popular, we can't, we could make, I mean, I can't make enough of those, so, we, he asked me to do a project, and at the same, and this is what generally happens, is at the same time, Esteban's telling me that the church needs help with this program, which has become even more critical because of all the problems that have been happening in Nicaragua, there's people whose dad's been there. have left to go to the border there's people whose moms have lost their jobs and right and these kids are like out in the streets just running fucking wild and so this don bosco program they they do a lot with those kids um so you know of course i mean every day i walk around i'm pulling money out of my pocket for one thing or another that's just part of the deal but um in this case gary I mean, Jerry was asking me for a special project at the same time, the church was asking us for a pretty significant amount of money to help them out, and, you know, people like Nestor Placencia, for example, give so much to this church, and Esteban's been a member there for 20 years, and, you know, I think he has a, he fills this obligation to do as much as the other guys do. Right.

And, you know, of course he can't do as much as Nestor Placencia, but… Yeah. I mean, that guy owns… He's a billionaire. Right. So, two things happened.

One, we were going to do the project, and we were going to give 100% of our profits at the factory level, which is we make about 30%. S. for. Of course, yours, we do about 80%.

Right, of course. My cigars are 30%. " Oh, no shit. Which actually, so all together it's about $15,000 or $20,000.

Nice. So it's a pretty decent chunk of money. I mean, you know, the average annual salary for someone down there who has a really good job is $3,000 or $4,000 a year. So this is basically, you know, it's a pretty significant chunk of money.

So money's being donated on the factory level, right? Right. That's Esteban and I. Right.

On the Aroma Craft level, right? No. Not on the Aroma Craft level. Not on the Aroma Craft level.

And on Gary's part. Gary is doing it, yeah. So what's happened so far, last year's crop of broadleaf was really bad. Right.

S. Connecticut Broadleaf, maybe 5,000 pounds, depending if it's XL or whatever, and last year, two years ago, we had about 1,500 pounds extra from what we needed, so instead of making more cigars, we kind of held that in reserve, and then this year, we only had 1,500 pounds total, so that came available in November, so that's the tobacco we would have used. This fiscal year, it was just a bad crop, all kinds of things, we've begged, borrowed, we've gone to Frank Miller at Lancaster Leaf in Dominican, we've gone to Gus Kira at Nicoprosa, we've, you know, traded stuff we did have for, because, you know, the heavy broadleaf we use for Cro-Magnon, a lot of people don't use that heavy stuff. So, at the end of the, the bottom line of that is, is we're only, this year, making about half as many Cro-Magnon as we usually make.

So that's part of the reason why we're bringing Whiskey Rebellion National, that's part of the reason why we did the Weaselito, it's part of the reason why we had a little bit of room to do these kind of projects in January, February, and March. And we'll have room at the end of the year to do a little bit more of those kinds of things, but, you know, I could release 400 boxes or 500 boxes to one retailer, or I could release 500 boxes to 300 retailers. Right. Right.

And these are guys that you've done business with for a long time. Yeah, I mean, we've done the Firecracker Project. Right. We've done a lot of our kind of annual limited releases like Blockhead and stuff like that were store exclusives originally.

Right. I mean, mine was Skeeter. Yeah. And we know the AWS IB.

Right. And that was before Powstanian in Quimero. Right. This year we're doing One For You.

Right. I remember that. We're doing the War Pig. The War Pig.

War Bear. War Bear. War Bear. War Pig is next year.

Sorry, I let the cat out of the bag. No, SBC is next year. Yeah. That's actually a great cigar.

Yeah. Yeah. You're really excited about that one. Yeah.

I mean, there's been some things you've done. You know. I'm not a big fan of it. Right.

So, like, when you say that you like one, I was like, holy shit. Yeah. It's really good. It's actually better than I expected it to be.

We actually made a change to it from when you were at the factory at the foot, but it's even better. A little tweaking. Yeah. And then we're doing the new size of the Guimro.

So I'll give you an example of why that one comes around. So Esteban comes to me and he says, "Hey, here's the production plan for Q1. Here's the production plan for Q2. We have a lot of the San Andreas is coming out of the Pallone in April.

So what we have left, we've made all the Neanderthals, we've made all the SGPs, we've made all the GDs, we've made everything you've asked me to make, but we still have a lot of small San Andreas. Okay. So I'm like, well, he's like, do you want me to make more SGPs? And I'm like, well, no.

Right. I'm like, well, why not make another small Guimero? Right. Because we have enough tobacco to make 5,000 of those, let's do that.

So, that's where a lot of those things kind of come around is the tobacco really dictates some of that stuff. Right. So, you like the War Bear? I do like it.

And that new Guaymaro is probably my favorite of the four sizes. I mean, that was kind of like a surprise. " He was a little whiny because he had just come back from Nicaragua and he didn't know about it. Yeah, like how did...

I was whiny? You were a little whiny. So, we do this kind of 360 review thing where we give reviews to the guys and then, you know, Danny, John doesn't have anything but positive stuff to say. Danny, of course, has something to whine about.

Right. " Right, no doubt. You got another one coming out too. The BACA.

BACA? Yeah, Cameroon. So you were working on that Cameroon when I was down there in February. We've been working on it for about a year and a half, I think.

I mean, you didn't really talk about it too much. So what's going on with that? Yeah, what's going on with that? Jack Dorano is a really good friend of mine.

Right. I mean, probably one of the guys, I mean, if you don't like Jack Dorano, you need a question. You're an asshole. You're an asshole.

Right. So, Jack, since he made the move, even when Jack was with Roberto Duran, him and Sam would come over and, you know, Jack always visits the factory when he comes into town. Esteban actually started, you know, in 1992 or something with Sergio Cuevas, David Davis, who was partners with Carlos Torraño. Raúl, Esteban's brother, who actually now manages NAXA and works with Steve Saca, as an example, for one.

Raúl actually went on the Dunhill sign range, kind of tour through Europe for Carlos Torraño, and around that same time, Esteban moved from the Dominican in 1997 to Nicaragua, and he started working at a factory that went out of business in like a month, and then he got a job with Fidel. Oliva's working at Latin Cigar. There was three or four pairs, small factory. That became one of the largest factories in Nicaragua, later became STG, the factory right when you come into town.

And they made Toronto Cigars for 20-something years. And so Jack had asked us, he said, look, I really want to make something. It never really worked out. When Jack went to General Cigar, I think he was struggling a lot with getting new, innovative I mean, they were doing things with Romeo and Julieta, they were doing things with Hoyo, but they really weren't doing anything to help the Taranio line, and they haven't really since.

Yeah, he talked about that when he was here. Yeah, no Jack, no Taranio. No Jack, no Taranio sampler. So Jack had been asking us for years, just kind of like, you know, you were talking about a minute ago, where one day I said, you know, I really would like to work with Cameroon.

" So, I asked Esteban, as I always do, we're sitting there, and I said, Esteban, what was the blend for the 1960 Cameroon? He's like, okay, it's Cameroon Rapper, Yamastron Binder, Yamastron Viso, Yamastron, I mean, he, like, yelled, like, off the top of his fucking head, I mean, and no bullshit, he has, like, this Looney Tunes fucking binder, have you seen it? Yeah, I was gonna ask, oh, you told me about it. And it has every blend he's ever worked on in 20 something years.

Every one of them. And, you know, a lot of people took credit as the blender, but the blender really is the guy who selects and buys the tobacco. Right. Like, you blended Powstanie.

Right. But really, we gave you the tobacco to blend Powstanie. Exactly. " Right.

Right. I couldn't tell you the fucking difference. Now, you did blend the 1-2-3 Sycamore or whatever. Right, 3-20 Sycamore.

And that's kind of a piece of dog shit. Yeah, that's one that you fucking hate. Yeah. I also blended the fucking Warbear, so fuck you.

That's a good cigar. Right. You haven't quite grabbed the pebble from my hand, Grasshopper, right? I don't know, man.

You've told me a couple times that I have, so, you know. You did pretty good with that. Thanks. Thanks.

But that's what you do, because I don't get up until noon. I come into the factory like one or two. You get in there early and manipulate Esteban. It's not really the manipulation thing.

And they're doing things for you. I think I've heard I gotta get in there before. Skip it. " I was just working on something.

Right. So... You gotta go a little deeper than just Esteban, too. So I told Jack Wilmer...

Yeah, you gotta know the guys. Well, yeah, 20 bucks a little long. Yeah, absolutely. 20 bucks a little cigar hustling.

Hey, what's up, man? I need this cigar made. So, I told Jack, I said, "Look, here's what I'm willing to do. I am willing, if you, because, I mean, I've gone through the warehouse in Santiago with Benjamin Endez and just seen the tobacco that they have, and, you know, I know the tobaccos we use really, really well, I know most of the tobaccos that I can get access to in Esteli pretty well, and this is what always happens, that people will say things like, this is the year of the Ecuador, Connecticut, or this is the year of the San Andreas, or here's what really happens.

Somebody either decides that they're going to start bringing a new kind of tobacco in or, like in our case, when we started making the Brazil Adapodaca, nobody was using Adapodaca except for Scandinavia. " So we started bringing Adapodaca in, all of a sudden there's like eight other cigars with Adapodaca. Right. And I don't have any problem with that.

I mean, that's like what happens is the local market starts getting in okra, and all of a sudden all the restaurants start selling okra dishes. Right. Right. It's not that this is the year of the Connecticut, that's what happened to be at the market this week.

Right. That's what was available, that's what people could get. Yeah. Yeah.

So, I mean, for example, when we started using the Double Harrow, Pennsylvania, nobody was using it. I mean, that was something they ground up and scrapped. The Green River Valley? When we started using the Green River Sucker One, now five or six other people have started to try to use it.

No one understands it, I don't think, is the way we do, but, I mean, the Neanderthal is the only way you can really make a cigar with that. Right. " I mean, there's only three people who are really doing Cameroon. Oliva does it with the G, and I forget the name of the family from Africa, that it starts with an M.

I should know this, but I don't. Right. So this family has been selling to Gilberto forever, and now, particularly with Jay Cortez, they have as much money as they need to buy whatever they need. Right.

Then STG has it, but mainly most of that stuff gets done in Santiago, and then there's another place that has it, that's where we get our yield for the Cameroon, for the binder. So we said, you know, if I can go into your warehouse with Esteban and we can go pick out the tobacco we want, then we'll blend one of these for you. It's our interpretation of the original 1916 Cameroon. Right.

Because it's something that a lot of people don't talk about. And this isn't an evaluation of whether this is good or bad. This is just the facts. Fidel Olivas, in one example, Fidel Olivas was a farmer.

Fidel Olivas had tobacco in SLE. Fidel Olivas was one of the very first people to build relationships to cultivate tobacco in Pueblo Nuevo. Fidel Olivas had processing in farms of Esteli and Regadillo, which is probably the best Esteli leaf. Now, there's none grown there, and it's a shame.

That's where you took me. That's the mountains, right? Yeah. And so, when Swedish Match purchased CAO, the production was still being done at Latin Cigar.

Then Scandinavia bought Swedish Match, and Swedish Match, the CAO thing got pulled up under General Cigar, if I have that correct, I'm pretty sure I do. Mm-hmm. That whole time... We don't fact check.

Esteban... Esteban worked... Do you need another cigar? I got one.

Okay. Esteban was managing the Scandinavia factory. " Fidel was making the majority of the cigars a Latin cigar with his own tobacco. A lot of the blends had Pueblo Nuevo, a lot of the blends had his proprietary kind of tobacco.

And then, of course, when Scandinavia took over, what they decided to do was not to buy tobacco from Fidel Olivas anymore. Because right in the middle of all that, Fidel Olivas just happened to start a whole 'nother factory and was using his best tobacco at the other factory. He was taking a lot of customers from Latin Cigar, like the Newmans, and Gurkha, and Taranio, and so there was not a good separation there, kind of like, you know, we talked about earlier with Jeff. Partners.

Partners. So, what was happening, one of the number one projects that Esson had worked on, that he was very, very, very proud of, late on, was the La Traviata. Mm-hmm. And they had substituted a lot of the original material in that blend for things that they had from their farms in Honduras or Dominican or whatever.

And so it completely changed the blend. Right. Right. And he really took that personal.

Like, there's no integrity of the blend. It's just a bullshit brand. Right. And I'm not saying the old one's better or worse than the new one.

I'm just saying… It's different. It's different. It's different, and he wasn't happy about it. Mike Palmer's in the room, everybody.

Right. So 1916 Cameroon was one of those where the tobacco that was used before was not used later. So our kind of whole pitch to Jack was we'll make it, but we're going to make it with the original blend. We're going to go to the farm where the original hamistron was purchased, but we need to get the Cameroon from you, and by the way, we're not using Colombian.

Because Colombian was in the original blend, and Colombian was kind of like this filler tobacco that Latin Cigar used a lot, which I'm just not a huge fan of. Right. So we were going to substitute the Colombian tobacco, and we were going to do our own kind of spin on it and do a limited edition version. So we started blending that, which is really my first time ever blending with Cameroon.

Right. And was also really kind of an eye-opener for Esteban, saying, you know, how do we switch out things and make it better? Right. And so, you know, longer story shorter, in the middle of that is when Scandinavia took a kind of a left turn on Taranio as a brand in Can Jack.

Fueling the growth. Fueling the growth. Right. So, at that point for us, it was, we're not trying to replicate these sizes of the original in 1916 anymore.

What if we made the Cro-Magnon sizes, and what if we did it more consistent with our tobaccos, and just did our own version? What is the best Cameroon we could make? And so that's when we started making, I think we did about 10 other varieties of it. It still has the core of Honduran tobacco, still has the core of the Cameroon.

We changed up the binder and some of the filler. It's got your tweak on it. Yeah, and then this is the first time we've actually taken the blend back to Austin, and as a team, we've smoked all the different finalists. Which, I just want to say that I think that's complete horseshit.

I feel like I should have been incorporated in that, and you should have at least sent me a couple. Well, I'm with you, brother. You know what I mean? This is fucking, what the fuck?

Well, it's, all I can tell you is, almost always, when we get down to the final three or four, Esteban and I almost always land on the same one. Really? There have been a couple of times where Mike and I have landed on one, and Esteban was kind of the odd man out. But this time, almost everyone universally agreed that this was the best option.

And it's completely different than most things we make, because it's, you know, everything we make, you could say that's a Nico Suenius cigar. Because it has a very signature kind of characteristic, I mean it tastes like the factory smells like you say a lot, and this one is completely different, and it's, I've smoked a lot of Cameroon cigars, traveling I'm like okay let me get the La Flor Cameroon, let me get this Cameroon, let me get that one, and if it comes out as good as I think it's going to it's probably I think one of the best Cameroon cigars. Okay. Well, I call it Baca.

So, there's four kind of deviants of the original early modern human. There's Cro-Magnon and Neanderthal, the Denobians and Asia, and then there's what they call the ghost DNA, which is, they've only found like a finger. " There's this other chromosomal artifact that they called the ghost part of the DNA, ghost chromosome, because they don't know where it came from. And there was a guy in North Carolina that had this, and they tracked it back to this pygmy tribe in Africa.

And so it's the fourth leg of the early modern human. Aha. And it's Africa, Cameroon. You know, the Neanderthal was discovered in Germany.

Right. The Cro-Magnon was discovered in France. And then this is Cameroon. So what you're saying is there's a lot of detail in everything that you do and everything that you name.

Well, I try to make it relevant. I mean, at the end of the day, it's just the Cameroon Robusto. And if that's all you know, then that's… That doesn't sound quite as good as the Roca. If that's all you know, you can still enjoy the cigar.

Right. But once you get kind of more engaged with the brand, you know, you take the first label off, There's something underneath it, there's a little, you know, every name, like, one of the sizes is called Otabanga, and he actually is not baka, he's not a pygmy, I mean, he is a pygmy, but he wasn't bakma, he was more of a Congolese pygmy, but you could Wikipedia this, but Otabanga is, this is a fucked up story, but literally he's a guy that they snatched out of Africa, and they put him in a zoo. No shit. Like he was an animal.

- Wow. Damn. - And then, yeah, it's, you have to Wikipedia, you wouldn't believe if I told you this story. - Right.

- But yeah, so you get this name called Otabanga, and it's like, what the fuck is Otabanga? - Mm-hmm. - And then you go wiki and go, holy shit, I can't believe we did that. - That's crazy.

- Yeah, they literally had this human being in a zoo. - That's fuckin'... - Yeah. So, I mean, those kinds of things are fascinating to me.

The whole subculture cigars is about, you know, the anthropological kind of aspect of this, the historical aspect, that's kind of what we... Right. You got to name it something. Right.

I mean, you could name it something that, you know. I mean, when you were coming up with your brand. Right. My advice, maybe the best advice you ever had, I don't know.

Possibly, possibly. It seems to be a theme tonight. Right. But I gave you this advice of make it personal.

Yeah, no, no doubt. Right, I mean, at the end of the day, it's the funny-looking Polish one with Perfecto. Right. But if you start to learn, I mean, I've learned even since then about the uprising in Poland.

I've had people come into the factory from Poland, and they're with, like, some Peace Corps group or whatever, and then they see that example box sitting there, and they go, holy cow, what is this? I'm like, well, that's a brand we make for this guy. I'm like, do you know what this is? I'm like, yeah, I know what it is.

Right. And then they tell me the whole story about, you know, the Polish uprising and Warsaw and everything, And I'm like, yeah, but someone, for someone who doesn't even smoke cigars, who sees that, they immediately connect with it, and then they're like, well, I want one of those boxes, and I'm like, well, I don't have any of those boxes, so then I have to get Freddy to bring, you know, boxes over for them, so make it personal, make it mean something, you know, people say, oh, man, this is, I mean, it's a whole lot better than just some gringo guy making up Spanish names, like Steve Saka, what the fuck is that? Yeah, yeah, fuck that guy. You know, Steve's one of my oldest – I was a huge Steve Saka fan before he knew who I was.

And years later, when I was in the business, I came over and sat with him and said, hey, man, you know, you're one of my idols in the business. He's like, who the fuck are you? I got a cigar brand. He's like, what?

Everybody's got a cigar brand now. Right. But since then, we've become more peers. Yeah, totally.

Yeah. Yeah, you know, I get along with him now. Arlen loves – in fact, the only cigar Arlen will smoke now is the Sin Compromiso. Yeah, that's the number one cigar in the Degenerate Weasels.

Yeah, I'm like, do you realize it's $18? But Steve loves that, that that's her favorite cigar. Oh yeah, he takes great pride in it. I mean, he won one of the Fiorellas that you had me bring up.

Yeah. I mean, you know, Steve, his online persona aside, Steve has a very... The interesting thing is once you know Steve, you really notice that Steve is worried that people aren't going to accept something. Right.

You know, like me, I honestly just make what I like, and either you buy it or you don't, right? Right. I think Steve really has always felt like he has this reputation he has to live up to. Right.

And so he, like, overdoes everything. Right. And so, that's where his... Waitress.

Oh, waitress? I think it's locked upstairs. Sorry. That's where all that stuff comes from.

Yeah. That's where all that comes from is out of this fear that he's not going to be successful. Right. If I was going to psychoanalyze him.

If you were going to psychoanalyze Steve Sako? Yeah. You know what's cool is like, he stopped in to say hi to me, you know, a few months ago. Like a month ago.

Like a month ago. Yeah. Which, you know, true estate Sako wouldn't. Who the fuck is this guy?

Right? But now, you know, it's totally different. Well, you know, Steve, if he had started with guys like you, I think he would be in a much better position now than he is. Now, he's got guys he's gone into because they brought in Drew Estate, Steve Sako, they never really supported his brand, and really it's guys like you that really do the best job with his brand, so he's kind of learned that lesson.

Oh, yeah. He's a smart guy, for sure. Alright, so I've got a couple other questions. I've got a lot more to tell you.

That alarm's probably on. David's car's still out there. Oh, okay. Okay.

I was telling her what his car looked like. This is what brings the touch of professionalism to this podcast. Oh, yeah. We're definitely not on that level.

We don't give a fuck. We're literally just recording a bullshit conversation in a garage. Right. And you know what it is.

Exactly. Wait a second. We're not in the fucking garage. Oh, yeah.

Come on. We're in the auxiliary. The non-smoking smoking lounge. There used to be my Bible study room.

So, what's going on with the Connecticut Chromag? Is that a thing? So, not really. Mike and Dan like to send ideas to Esteban without me know about it.

Right. You might want to start getting up earlier, it seems like a lot's happening before you get up. I mean, that's kind of bullshit, though, because we were talking about it, and you had it done when we were there. " Take the wrapper off and put a Connecticut on it, see how it smokes, yeah.

And give them all the check. Yeah, that's not something that's going to come out anytime soon, but... Okay. Why?

He seems so disappointed. Okay. Yeah. There's a long list of things to do.

I mean, one of my favorite cigars is the Brotherly Kindness, right? I mean, I smoke that cigar literally every day, right? So, you know, a different Connecticut shade coming out of that factory, I'm always intrigued, you know? I'm not a big fan of that.

S. Connecticut broadleaf. S. Connecticut broadleaf.

Because I remember back in the day things like Fuente would make some of those like La Unica and some other ones. The ones that I really liked, and it doesn't have that bitter, grassy taste that Ecuador, Connecticut has. Right. So, I've been looking for that, and if we can ever find some of that, we'll probably make like a black-Irish version, kind of four or five hundred boxes or something.

Right. Okay. You know, I've got like six tobacco plants I've grown at home, if you want, you know, a little something different. Right?

Yeah, the Florida shade-grown. The Florida sun-grown. Super elite. Okay, we're going to go ahead and cut off right here in part one of the Skip Martin Chronicles.

Stay tuned next week for part two, and then part three. Hello, this is a prepaid collect call from the Correctional Institution. This call is subject to recording and monitoring. To accept charges, press one.

To refuse charges, thank you for using. This has been a Cigar Hustlers Podcast, a Mike and Mike production. m. for a new episode.

Please rate, review, and subscribe for whichever providers you use. Come back next week for part two. Mike, Mike, Mike, Mike squared, squared, squared, squared, squared, squared.

Show Notes

Well only took 65 shows to get The Skip Martin on the air with us!

No offense to any other podcast he has been on, but this is the real Skip Martin!  Stories and information you have never heard before!

From his beginnings as a small child running a Porn Kingdom to now being an Industry Titan in the Cigar Business!  Nothing has been left out!

Only problem is once we got him talking it seemed to never end!  This is Part 1 of a 3 Part series.

So sit back and get comfortable!  This starts "The Skip Martin Chronicles"

As always we welcome your thoughts, concerns and show idea on our FB page "A Cigar Hustlers Podcast".  You can follow the show on IG @cigarhustlerspodcast, Mikey @cigarhustler and Mike Too @fcc_Mike