Special Interview with Jeremiah Meerapfel

Transcript

Let me know when you start

recording and I started

recording.

How's this cigar?

They're they're fantastic, man.

That one there, yeah.

You like that that size?

This is a great size for sure

man.

You like those thin ring gauges?

As well.

Lonsdale, Corona, Gorda.

You're a real cigar man.

Yeah, I think that you have to

be to be in the industry.

You know I.

You see a lot of small size ring

gauges out there.

Well, I just think that more

often than not, people that are

really kind of committed to it

are the guys that will smoke

that size.

God bless.

However, your number one

consumer is not that guy, right?

He's the 60 ring gauge, the the

ego guy, the person that has

something to prove right.

That's more often the case.

I think there needs to be

something for everyone, but I

certainly enjoy the smaller ring

gauges.

Yeah.

By far.

All right.

Well, hey, listen, the the man

of the hour, he needs no

introduction, but I'll go ahead

and introduce him anyways.

His name is Jeremiah Mirefeld.

His family has been in tobacco

since the dawn of time, and he

is the face of Cameroon.

Tobacco from Cameroon, Africa.

Say hi.

Hello.

And, and, and thank you for

pronouncing Merifil correctly.

Yeah, yeah, people, people have

an issue with that sometimes.

Well, I apologize if I screw it

up.

No, but you didn't.

Cool.

More often than not, usually

when someone says postana, they

say postani and almost like

whatever.

We can relate to.

This yeah, of course.

And then, you know, my last name

has no vowels, so it's not easy

to get that one right either.

So I kind of want to just jump

right into things 'cause I, I

have seen your responses and

they can be elaborate at times

and I want to give you that

opportunity to kind of respond.

So one thing that you said was

when you base your life on the

words and promises from

generations before before you,

it gets, it sets a tone.

What did you really mean by that

as far as a tone?

I don't understand your

question.

So like, so you know, as far as

generations are concerned, I I

like what you said, right,

You're talking about your basis

is based the reason why what

you're what you're kind of

motivated on is the fact of the

generations before you, right?

And that's really kind of what

has kind of got you going.

But like it has set you're

saying that it's set a tone and

like, what is that tone?

Is it is it a tone that requires

you to get up every every

morning at a specific time, make

sure specific ducks are in a row

when it comes to whatever it is

as far as Cameroon or production

wise as far as the transferring

of the tobacco or is it is it

more relaxed?

Is it more, hey, I know what I

have to do, but it can be done

at the leisure of myself, right?

Like what is the, what is the

what has given?

What tone?

Does that mean all?

Right now, I get it, OK?

I don't.

I don't think there's there's

anything we do apart from

enjoying those cigars, sitting

down with our friends, their

customers, lighting up that

cigar.

I don't think there's anything

we do on a professional level

which is relaxed, right?

To be able to travel through

time you constantly need to be

pushing the bar, pushing it

harder and further.

Typically family businesses that

end up disappearing is when

things get a bit comfortable and

a bit too relaxed.

And the 2nd, 3rd or 4th

generation are so relaxed that

the hardcore sacrifices

necessary for intergenerational

family businesses are no longer

there and the businesses are

either sold out to large

corporates or they disappear,

right?

And that's something you have to

be well aware of when you get

into a company like ours.

Not an easy choice to make, but

it's an essential choice because

there's nothing that's going to

be easy about it.

We're not looking for easy.

Our only objective is

intergenerational transmission.

And knowing that

intergenerational transmission

depends on pushing boundaries,

depends, ironically, on pain and

bleeding and vast amount of

blood, sweat and tears.

Without being cliche.

Because those are the choices

you need to make when you want

to stay in existence.

Do you think that you can set

convey that and set that tone

for your kids We.

Already have, yeah.

It starts when they're born.

It's, it's, it's, it's a

requirement.

Offering them an easy and

comfortable life full of luxury

is the best way to destroy them

in that optic.

You know, people, people used to

come to me and say, you know,

you're, you're crazy.

Why, why does your wife dress

your children, you know, in a

second hand clothes shop?

Why do you guys own a car and

not 2?

And why is that car a Subaru

Forester and not a a Bentley?

Why do you make choices in terms

of lifestyle, private intimate

lifestyle and that's preparing

the next generation.

So that's all that's great,

right?

I love all of that as a dad, you

kind of you have a like a plan,

right?

And you have an idea as to how

you want to instill principles

to your kids, right?

I think that some of the

challenges of that can be when

you have to travel around a lot

for work and you have to leave

them at home.

So what can you do to really

kind of keep those principles

and keep that belief?

I mean, to have the motivation

that you have is really

unparalleled, right to to push

harder than your father.

I would say from what I read is

I think is what you're trying to

do.

You're asking several questions

here.

Yeah.

But well, let me let me circle

back.

So, but how can you continue to

really to push even a fragment

of that or some of that into

your kids and still be able to

have the ability to kind of run

a company where you have to

travel and you have to go to to

all over the world?

I'm blessed at this stage of my

life.

I started a bit late.

I'm not going to go into that,

but my kids are young.

You didn't start very late.

I mean, we're are my kids are

close to your age.

I felt like I started at an

appropriate age.

Yeah, but I think you're a

little younger than I am.

Not by much, not by much.

Yesterday we had the pleasure of

of meeting and hugging, but I

believe you were hugging my

children before you hugged me.

Yeah.

That should partially answer

your question.

I spent an enormous amount of

time travelling with my

children, bringing them with me,

not because I want to pull them

out of school, but because I

believe that they need to

understand from the youngest

age, and they're young, what's

required and necessary to be in

this cigar and the tobacco

business.

This business is not about the

easy path, right?

This business is about tobacco

farms and anybody who's been in

a tobacco farm who's run a

tobacco farm knows how difficult

it is to grow tobacco and how

non glorious it is to grow

tobacco.

Right.

It's a very, very difficult job

and you need to be deeply in

love with Leaf to be in that

business.

Then there's the manufacturing,

there's the glorious side which

some people look at, but there's

the not so glorious side, which

is the work that needs to be put

in to produce fine cigars,

especially when you're not

cutting corners, right?

And then there's distribution

sales, there's retailing.

Nothing comes easy, as you know.

You.

Yeah, 100%.

Children need to understand that

they need to be exposed to it.

And so to answer your question,

kids spend a significant amount

of time travelling with daddy,

listening to daddy, going

around, meeting people in the

industry, developing both a

love, a deep love and affection

and understanding of what this

industry is about.

And at the same time realizing

the commitment that's necessary

to successfully inherit a torch

which they can then pass on to

the future generation.

My sister's here with me.

She's doing exactly the same

thing her children are with her,

doing exactly the same thing

that in my opinion.

Is what can give you a better

chance at survival over

centuries.

For me, I have one kid in

particular.

My all my kids love me as I'm

sure all your kids love you,

right?

It depends.

And it depends on the moment.

Depends if the cigar is good or.

Amongst other things I'm sure,

but I know that there's 1

specifically who really kind of

idolizes me and you can see it

that I can almost do no wrong

when it comes to one in

particular.

Do you feel like you have any

kid in particular that solely

idolizes absolutely everything

you do like to a next level than

the others?

I think you find that that's

often age driven as well.

Yeah.

There's periods in the kids

lives where you're Superman and

then all of a sudden you're no

longer Superman.

Right.

Well, you so yeah, I know.

I agree with you as far as kids

kind of go through.

I see where you're going with

the question.

I I think that I'm happy to see

that the three children are

proud of their father.

I think that because of the

mechanics of how we work and how

we communicate and how they

participate in my life, I think

they realize the sacrifices that

are made for what in our family

we consider the greater good and

the greater good is the leaf.

And we speak a lot.

And with my wife as well,

there's a lot of communication.

And so they are, they can hear

what's being voiced.

They can hear the sacrifices

that are being made.

You know, when sometimes as

anybody else in the world, you

know, I might sit down exhausted

and feeling disappointed with

certain things and voicing that

discontent where I don't

understand why somebody would

cut a corner or why somebody

would would want to make a

decision which doesn't bring up

the quality of a product or make

it or make it better, make it

what it should be.

And it's good that they hear all

of this and it's good that it

makes them proud.

And it's good that that instills

those values, those deep values

of we consider ourselves

samurais of samurais of the

leaf.

We consider ourselves samurais

of the cigars.

And we'd rather go Heracuri than

doing it the wrong way.

And that's important for kids to

understand.

Absolutely.

I couldn't agree more.

I think this one, this is the

one of the biggest challenges,

right?

And you know, I think that we

all always look back and say,

you know, am I doing this right?

Am I messing them up?

You know, I'm definitely.

Oh, that's going to happen

anyways.

That's that's a given, right?

So when things kind of started,

I'll kind of back up to your dad

and forgive me if I mess any of

this up, but to start growing

tobacco in Cameroon had to be, I

mean, I, I can understand the

vision, however, I couldn't

imagine it being profitable for

a long period of time.

It's, I don't think you know,

correct me if I'm wrong, but

there's no way that you just

kind of started to grow and it

was instant success.

Like what?

What do you think motivated your

father to keep going and keep

growing and developing all the

tobacco in Cameroon?

It's very difficult for me to

speak about this, but I'll

answer your question because

it's a very good question.

It's a very deep question.

I don't know where this is

coming from because typically

nobody's asked me these

questions before.

This is a very, very serious

question.

You're asking me.

What I'm about to tell you is a

very, very personal answer.

My father went to Cameroon for

the first time in 1969.

My grandfather was already

trading Cameroon tobacco, and

when dad went there, he was, I

think it was 69, he was about 18

years old, and he lived there.

He lived in the jungle in

eastern Cameroon, in western

central Africa.

You have kids and you now

realize that 18 is still a kid,

isn't?

It for sure.

And he's working there.

For those who knew my father, he

was an insanely empathetic human

being.

Anybody who met him, knew him,

were deeply touched by his

empathetic characteristics.

It's a good person, deeply good

person.

And by some unknown reason, for

some unknown reason, he was

accepted into the Pygmy tribe.

Now, in those days, the Pygmies,

and still now, but particularly

in those days, they did not

communicate with the outside

world, not with any of the other

tribes.

And there's many, many, many

hundreds of them in the area,

even more from people coming

from outside, outside country

outside.

And he was an outsider.

He was brought into the tribe

and he spent time with them and

he lived with them.

And typical to my father, he

fell in love with the

populations down there.

He deeply fell in love with the

populations down there.

Many years later, when the

French monopoly who owns the

assets in the area for tobacco

growing, decided to abandoned

tobacco because it was mostly

used for the Gitan cigarettes

and the Galois cigarettes, which

were dark tobacco cigarettes.

And they they, they disappeared

from the European markets.

My father understood the

repercussions that was going to

have on the local populations.

We're talking hundreds of

thousands of people impacted.

If something like this happened

and there's nothing else, the

livelihood of his, of his

family, they, they became his

family.

He, he considered them family

was going to vanish in the

middle of the jungle.

And so he, he made a very bold

move.

He bought out the French

monopoly and he saved Cameroon,

but he wasn't saving Cameron

Rapper.

He was saving the people in the

area.

Years later, he was awarded by

the Central African government

Honorary Minister of Education

because he educated more people

than they could afford to

educate.

Honorary Minister of Health

because he subsidized more

clinics than the government was

able to subsidize.

Now keep in mind, Central Africa

is, I believe, the second

poorest country on the planet.

Never told anybody about this.

There was no social corporate

responsibility marketing

bullshit.

He was doing what he was doing

very quietly because he truly

loved the people.

There was not a foundation where

they.

Select a few people to do this

or a few people to do that.

This is on a vast skill for

anybody who needed it.

So what really kept him going?

Go ahead.

When he bought the monopoly,

this was the early 90s and in

the early 90s it was the

beginning of what was going to

be a very big boom in the United

States in the cigar industry.

As you also know, Cameroon post

embargo was extremely important

for the old Cuban families.

Why Heller?

My grandfather was the largest

exporter of Cuban tobacco in

history, the last crop before

the embargo. 100% of the export

was in his hands and brought to

the United States of America.

Why the USA was producing at

that time 9 billion cigars with

Cuban tobacco machine made

mostly wow in the United States

when they no longer had access

to Cuban tobacco.

Many of the families, the

Menendez, they were in the

Canary Islands.

You had the Bayer factory, which

was later owned by the Commons

in Dothan, AL, where I was

actually born whilst my father

was a mechanic working at the

Bayer factory.

A lot of them replaced the

tobacco, the Cuban tobacco with

this.

What made sense to replace that

Cuban tobacco and the tobacco

men chose Cameroon.

Got it.

And so we're in the 90s here,

boom's starting to arrive, and

anybody and everybody is trying

to access rapper.

Accessing rapper gives you the

tools to grow as a company and

to survive as a company during a

boom, especially a boom like

this one.

Cameroon was used on every

single one of the superstars at

that time apart from the

Macanudos and that used the

Connecticut shade.

The Coleman's used their tobacco

from the valley on the

Macanudos.

All of the very strong brands,

whether it was Cohiba, whether

it was Partagus, whether it was

Hoya de Monterrey, Altatis also

had a cigar.

Obviously the Fuentes built the

a lot of the Gran Reservoir, the

Don Carlos lines, the Hemingway

lines, Jimenez family, La

Aurora, the Preferidos, Cameroon

fuelled all of this growth.

And so during this boom, even

though some manufacturers tried

to offer blank checks to my

father to buy every single leaf

he was able to produce, Richard

Merrifield would turn around and

say, no, everybody has the right

to survive.

Everybody has the right to grow.

That's not a way of conducting

business so.

He always.

Very faithful friends and a very

faithful man.

And so he did well.

He did well.

Not as well as he could have

done if he accepted offers to

screw people left, right and

center.

Right.

But he did it the mareful way,

honestly, one foot in front of

the other with dignity and

respect.

Years later, it became a lot

tougher.

Manufacturers start cutting

corners.

The boom's not there anymore.

Hey, let's try to take some

Cameroon seed and grow it in

Ecuador at a price that would

production cost 10 or 15 times

lower than it what it would cost

in Cameroon.

Right.

Hey, let's take another type of

rapper that looks like Cameroon.

Let's slap it on a cigar because

we we believe the consumer's an

idiot and we can get away with

it.

I remember that specifically.

But being arrogant and taking

the consumer for an idiot is the

biggest mistake one can do

because the consumer knows.

Right.

And at the end of the day, it

bites back and my father refused

to play that game.

And all of a sudden, the sale of

Cameroon started going down and

down and down because more and

more people started cutting

corners.

Cameroon is the most expensive

leaf on the planet to grow by a

mile.

Without getting into numbers and

figures, a wonderful rapper

very, very high end would cost

the manufacturer 40 bucks a

pound, 50 bucks a pound, 60

bucks a pound, Whatever it might

be, you can multiply that by

several times.

What would cost the manufacturer

to put Cameroon on a on a cigar.

Why?

Because the yields are so low.

Not only the yields, the yields

in the farms, which are probably

10 times lower than most of the

rappers you know in the world,

but also because once the bills

arrives to the factory, there's

a lot of wastage.

Right.

And so you end up with

unbelievably low yields and

extremely high value tobacco and

that's typically not always a

choice that everybody wants to

make.

Right.

When they're running their

business, and I respect that

going to your question, but

who's financing all of this?

If all of a sudden it's not so

profitable anymore or it's not

profitable at all anymore, who's

financing this?

The family?

Why?

Because it is unconceivable.

Unconceivable as long as it's

possible.

As long as we're able to abandon

our families in the middle of

the jungle because companies

become too corporate.

Companies want to optimize right

their profitability, and this,

my friend, is what the Mirfield

family has been doing now for

many, many years.

Did anybody in the family think

he was crazy?

Oh, they all think I'm crazy

now.

OK.

So as far as the vision.

But that's a joke because

everybody understands and

everybody respects it.

I don't think ever.

My sister turned around and

said, Jeremiah, you're doing the

wrong thing by following the

footsteps of what dad thought

was right and quite the

contrary.

So thank God, thank God every

member of this family is very

much aligned on what's right in

life and what's wrong in life.

And if we have to burn to the

ground yet once again, like

almost every generation over the

past 400 years because we will

do what we believe is right,

then so be it.

But I also believe that's the

secret why we're still here.

Right.

OK.

I mean, it's remarkable, man,

you know, to do what he did and

really kind of set that

precedence you, you would assume

that loved ones around him would

have thought that, hey, you're

out of your mind.

There's like you're going to

what you know, there's this is a

terrible idea.

Well, it's not the loved ones

who think that loved ones love

us because we do this, because

they know how we think.

It's more the financial

directors or the, or the

bankers, whatever it is, who

think we're out of our mind.

But I think that those who know

us and those who've worked as us

for such a long time and many of

the people in the company, you

know, have been there

intergenerationally or people

they, you know that they worked

with intergenerationally.

Some companies we work with, I'm

speaking within the company as,

as the management are for are

for many generations, OK.

And they know, they know us and,

and I think they, I think they

respected, I think they, I think

they respect hard choices, not

always easy.

And we've paid heavy prices for

making choices like this and

heavy and what we believe to be

right choices.

It's hard, but I wouldn't have

it any other way and neither

would any other member of my

family.

So obviously you work with your

family, right?

What's it like?

I work my brother's, my business

partner, right?

He brings something to the table

that I don't bring.

And we work very well together.

And normally when you run into a

business, you kind of see that

what's it like working with your

brother?

Well, I have the honor and the

advantage of working with both

my brother and my sister, and it

depends of the day.

I mean, sometimes I want to

strangle them, sometimes they

want to strangle me, and

sometimes I think it's the best

thing in the world.

And that's what family is all

about.

Sure.

But what it does do is bring to

the table a common ideology of

we know where we came from and

we know where we want to go.

And I'm not sure or I strongly

believe rather that that's what

gives certain encouragements of

sacrifice is that commonality of

where we're going?

Does that answer your question?

I think to some degree, yeah.

You know, there's, there's

always a lot of.

It's very, you know, I'm not

going to sit here and and and

and and tell you, yeah, yeah,

yeah.

You know, we're, you know,

let's, let's, let's, let's all

pose on a postcard here and

smile and.

Merry Christmas.

It's bullshit, you know, That's

what families are about.

You punch each other, you love

each other, you kick each other

and you kiss each other.

And if it doesn't work that way,

and if it's not what you're

seeing, then something is wrong.

For sure.

I mean, conflict, definitely, as

long as everybody's heart's in

the right place.

Exactly.

It helps, right?

It actually pushes things in the

right direction.

How so when it comes to your

brother, because I only hear

quiet rumblings about him,

right?

I'm assuming that he, so he has

helped really kind of grow the

Fuente organization overseas, is

that correct?

What exactly?

What does he do?

Joshua, Yeah, Joshua and I

started, let's say our career,

so to speak, or the the more

responsible part of our careers

when our father passed away over

20 years ago.

Right.

And there were two main

objectives.

The first was, and, and most

people don't know this, my

father passed away after we were

expropriated in Central Africa.

So we'd lost, we'd lost

everything in terms of the

growing operations.

It was very complicated.

The business was under a lot of

heat in terms of the growing and

in terms of continuity for

Cameroon, what we call Cameroon

Tobacco.

And so the first challenge was,

all right, how do we get

ourselves out of this and how do

we continue dad's dream?

How do we maintain it?

And then how do we appropriate

ourselves with that same dream

and how do we push it along?

How do we understand it?

How do we make it happen?

Very complicated, very

complicated.

I was 24 years old and Josh was

22.

It's very complicated when

you're young kids trying to take

on such a big challenge.

In parallel to that, the family

was running distribution

companies.

We were developing markets,

premium cigar markets in the

Eastern Hemisphere since the

early 1960s, first with Cuba.

My grandfather left Cuba with

two licenses in his back pocket,

the first being habanos.

He was one of the very few

people in the world that was

licensed by the government, the

Cuban government, to trade their

tobacco.

And we did so for many, many,

many, many years.

And the second thing was, sorry,

Cuba tobacco.

And the second license with the

habanos, which was Cuban cigars,

he introduced Cohiba to Europe.

He's the first person, first

company to introduce Cohiba

commercially to Europe.

We're distributing all of the

Cuban brands following that.

This is going back.

Remember 19, sixties, 1970s, We

had friends that said, hey, can

you help us out?

You know, can you, can you

develop, can you develop our

cigars in the Eastern

Hemisphere?

Most of these companies were

small companies that just

started out, one of them being

the Fuentes in the early 80s.

Dad was very, very close to

Carlos Senior and Carlos Junior.

Very close.

I mean insanely close.

Loved them deeply, protected

them deeply, became the

godfather of of Carlito's only

son.

And in the early 80s when they

were producing relatively mild

cigars for the US market,

because in those days what was

selling Candela and Connecticut

shade, that was the market, the

main market in the United States

for a premium cigars.

They decided to retweak brands

of blends for the European

market.

They wanted, they wanted us to

carry and to develop their

cigars for for the Eastern

Hemisphere in those days,

specifically Europe, because

that's where the cigars were

being consumed.

That's where people were

idolizing Cuba.

That's where the old prestige

was coming from.

You know, if you could make it

in Europe, you could make it

anywhere.

This is where all the greatest

cigars, Cuban cigar brands on

the planet were being consumed,

right?

It created the what is known

since then as the Don Carlos

line.

That Don Carlos line was was to

focus on the to come and and and

focus on the palate of the

European, European consumer and

develop those brands for for 40

years in the Eastern hemisphere.

So Josh and I, and later my

sister.

Continue to do what we love, do

what our family does, keep a

piece of our father with us in

our hearts, and continue growing

tobacco, blending cigars and

building brands.

So your father passes

unexpectedly and you're kind of

the three of you are kind of

thrust into this position of we

have to now figure out what the

miracle name is going to be

moving forward, right?

How do you determine roles?

Hey, OK, I'm you know, this is

what I'm going to do, right?

I'm going to be the face and

really continue to develop the

brand and you're going to do

this.

And you know, you and your

brother are very close in age.

Did he was he OK with it?

Was there?

You know, yes, this is the right

way or this is the only way.

Like how do what does that look

like?

You know, I have two kids, I

have two boys and I have a

little girl, right?

I don't know what the future

holds for me as far as this

industry, but if it keeps going

down the path that it's going, I

think that it could be

generational, right?

And when my time comes, no

matter whether I plan for it or

not, I think that there's going

to be a conversation as to who

does what.

What.

What did that look like for you

and?

Did it wind up being what

everybody wanted it to be?

It's a very, very tough question

because nothing is static and

things change over time.

People grow into things over

time as well.

I think it's difficult to kind

of plan ahead and try to believe

that we know where things are

going to go.

And I think that we need to have

faith in life and time because

things naturally happen and

naturally take form.

Are the roles the same today,

for example, than they were in

2003 when my father passed away?

Absolutely not.

Did anybody plan what the roles

would be?

Absolutely not.

Have things changed over time

naturally?

Absolutely.

I think what's important though,

is that as long as there's

respect and common interests and

common values that are passed

down to our children, that is

what enables things to happen in

a positive way or a more

peaceful way or a less peaceful

way.

And that's the focus.

If your question is what do I

have to do for my kids to

continue what I'm doing?

Spend as much time, in my humble

opinion, unconditionally

bringing them together and

making sure they have common

interests and values and that

they marry the right person.

Yeah, that's very true.

Like my mother used to say.

Pick.

Pick the right one.

Pick the right wife or the right

husband.

Absolutely.

You're at 24 years old, you're

pushed into this patriarch

position.

You're the oldest.

And I understand protecting your

kids and, and teaching them

values and stuff and all of, and

what comes of that.

But you also have a duty to your

siblings to some degree, right?

You have to look out for them

just as much.

No, I mean, my brother could

call me anytime, anyplace.

It doesn't matter.

He's my older brother, right,

And that's why I kind of see

fascinating about all of this,

right, because he's the older

brother.

He's not the face he builds and

he and he's very he's extremely

valuable to the to the our

entire business.

But like you have the hat.

How does he feel about that?

Did you know, did the passing of

your father impact him just as

much as it impacted you?

And how does that make him feel?

You know, you talk about your

dad being great when it comes to

empathy.

I'm curious as to what how that

empathy correlates with you and

when it comes to developing the

future of Mirfield and not with

your kids yet, but with the core

brother and sister that you have

right now, how does that make

him feel?

I don't know, you know, but I'm

curious.

There's not the slightest doubt

in my mind that there's not a

child on the on planet Earth or

certainly not in our family that

wasn't devastated by losing a

parent.

It would be insanity or horrible

to even think that it would

affect one or another in a, in

a, in a Obviously it always does

in a different way.

But at the end of the day, it's

devastating.

And the pain that everybody

feels is immeasurable, as you

know, right?

I would hope that he would be

proud in the same way that I'm

proud of him.

I would hope that anybody would,

any sibling in the world would

protect the interests of the

other, because that's what

brotherhood and sisterhood is

all about, even if it's not

always obvious or not always

easy, or not always.

Because families.

Everybody has a brother and a

sister and knows what a family

is all about.

But at the end of the day,

underlying everything is a huge

sense of protection.

Whether you're the oldest

brother, the youngest brother,

the tiny sister or the eldest

sister.

It's irrelevant.

Families are supposed to look

after each other, right?

And they're supposed to protect

each other.

So I'm not sure I understand the

question.

Just when it comes to

understanding and and

empathizing, do you know how

your brother feels about you

taking on the top role and you

having your grandfather's hat?

My brother came to me a few

years ago when when I finally

launched the Marifel cigar and

told me how proud he was about

about what was done and how how

amazing and exquisite it was.

And over the years we've, we've

shared and I think it's really

important to share one towards

another, showing pride and

showing affection.

I think tough love is, is, is

always there with certain

personalities and part of an

education because we're all, you

know, in our family, our father

or grandfather.

I mean, it was tough love, man,

to say the least.

You know, the canes came out,

the whips came out, you know

what I mean?

It's tough love, but there's

also a sense of appreciation and

a sense of pride and that's

something which which I believe

has been present and has enabled

a lot of great things to happen.

You know, for the longest time I

was, I've always been at odds

with my brother.

Always.

We're two totally different

people, you know, and we're

having tough love from a parent,

right?

Especially, you know, our

parents, you know, especially a

father's figure.

The the the term I love you or

the the that that term of

endearment doesn't come around

often, if ever.

Oh, I've told him and he's told

me absolutely.

I think that's very important.

And you said that your brother

has said that he's proud of you.

Do you feel like you're proud of

him?

Oh yeah, for sure.

And does he know that?

Yeah, for sure.

Yeah.

No question about it.

No question about it.

Do you tell him more often than

your father would tell you

because because of the way that

your father didn't give it, like

for the lack of that?

Or are you more along the lines

of your Father in that essence?

No, I think, I think that every

generation gets a bit softer and

a bit more commutative.

You know, the way I speak to my,

my, the way I speak to my

children or the way I would

speak to my brother or my sister

or anybody else of the family.

I think has more, I believe I

might be wrong, but I think has

more expression that than than

the generation before me and

certainly than the generation

before.

Oh yeah.

So yeah, yeah, definitely.

OK.

I'm going to turn it change a

little bit here.

You guys are doing what I think

is fantastic as far as this plan

where you have AQR code on your

boxes and you can set an

appointment, a brief appointment

to have a conversation with

yourself or Reinhardt.

You want to talk briefly about

that and then I'll get into a

couple other little things and

we'll let you off the hook.

No, because it's the craziest

thing I I've ever done and I'm

probably committed to.

Suicide.

By even accepting to go into a

program like.

This, I love this.

Who came up with this idea?

Who came, who came up with the

idea because it is absolutely

insane.

Yes, it is.

It is absolutely insane and I

think that it's genius.

It really is until it becomes

this complete cluster, which is

very possible.

But for it to get there, I mean,

for you guys to, so you test

boundaries, right?

We all do, at least those that

want to grow.

You push, you push and you see

what the response is.

And then you push a little

further and you push a little

further and you see what happens

like, oh, nothing happened, but

we can keep going.

OK, Oh, that's stung a little

bit, but we can keep going.

Like this is one of those ideas.

This is something that's totally

out of left field.

Nothing that I've ever seen done

before.

Number one, who came up with the

idea and #2 are you prepared at

the floodgates wind up being

wide open 'cause I think, I

think this could be incredible.

Tell me about a Marafal cigar.

Me.

Yeah.

I couldn't tell the story.

Even as passionate as I am about

the cigar industry and cigars,

even your cigars, I couldn't

tell the story.

All right, forget the miracle.

Cigars nearly as you love.

Cars, right?

This is a whole different.

Tell me about a Pagani.

What do you love in life?

I love my kids.

Forget the kids something

something that is not part of

your genetic what I'm trying to

get to.

Yeah.

Is that at a certain level of

certain things the customer has

a right to know?

Absolutely.

And when somebody's going to go

out and spend $50.00 or $70.00

or $80 or to be honest with you,

even if he spends $1.00 for all

I care, he has the right to

know.

Now, if you're going to go out

there and put a cigar at 60 or

80 bucks or 100 bucks and you

don't care about the customer

knowing or you don't have much

to explain to the customer to

know because you're just putting

a beautiful packaging in a

beautiful band.

And you're you're rebranding a

cigar off the rolling table that

you could sell at 2510 or $20.00

or $100, then you're going to

keep your mouth shut.

But if you just spent 20 years

or 25 years fine tuning

insanity, pushing the limits to

the next Galaxy, reinventing

certain things, forget the

price.

I'm speaking now about the

complexity.

I'm speaking about how difficult

it is.

I'm speaking about putting a

proposition on the table which

doesn't exist anywhere else in

the world.

Mark my words, this is a very

big statement.

Doesn't exist anywhere else in

the world.

Not because there's not another

cigar that maybe as good at it,

but because what has been done

has never been done before.

Not even close.

Does it make it better?

No.

Should you prefer the cigar?

No.

Should you go out and buy more

of those cigars?

No, but the proposition, what's

been done is insane.

I want people to know.

And when I was speaking to my

team and I said, how the hell

are we going to communicate on

this?

How are we going to educate?

How are we going to train our

partners in the world?

There's a big blank around the

conference room.

Everybody's thinking, how the

hell are we going to do this?

We'd have to sit down with every

partner for hours and hours and

hours and hours, go through

every single aspect of what

we've done to push this out of

what the cigar industry has ever

done.

And then pray to God that he

doesn't forget half of it.

And then pray to God that he's

able to communicate that to

store managers or to his

salesman, etcetera, etcetera.

How are we going to do this?

So we're going to do it in two

ways.

Number one, we're going to start

spending a lot more time with

our partners and we are going to

invest that time in explaining

to them something that they have

no way of knowing because it's

never been done before.

Right.

I love it.

Second thing, if a consumer

wants to understand, we'll give

it to them.

We'll explain it to them.

Because once you understand,

then all of a sudden those 50

bucks, 80 bucks, 100 bucks,

those $1000, that $10,000, that

$1,000,000, it doesn't matter

anymore, right?

You're understanding what's

going on at a very high level

and it's very intricate because

like I always say, those who

know, know, but you can't on

something which is breaking

every single rule in the book.

When I developed the cigar, and

I developed it over 20 years ago

when dad passed away, the

proposition was bold and very

arrogant.

Not arrogant in a bad way,

arrogant in a constructive way.

I want to make Daddy proud, and

I want to make what I think to

be the best cigar in the world.

Now, that's very different from

what you or somebody else might

think is the best cigar in the

world.

For me as a tobacco grower and

as a blender, that means putting

a different proposition on the

table doesn't mean it needs to

be a preferred cigar by the

consumer.

OK, And I want to make this very

clear.

How do you reinvent an industry?

How do you reinvent the rules of

what's been done?

And so the process was to take

every single element about what

a cigar is and to decompose it.

The box that goes up on the

wall.

How do we push the box to a

level that's either never been

done before or how do we

reinvent it?

The bends, The tobacco or the

aging of the tobacco?

The aging of the cigars, The

bands?

Did I say that?

Yes.

The ribbons.

Right.

Absolutely everything, it all

goes onto the wall and we start

working.

There's a reason this project

took 20 years.

It's not easy because thinking

out-of-the-box on on such a

traditional product is really

complicated.

And then once all of that is

done, then you put it all back

together.

But it's so fine and it's so

subtle sometimes and it's so

difficult to to capture if you

don't know about it that you're

missing out on what's actually

been done.

That's often the problem of

people going out and buying, you

know, Pagani cars.

I spoke about Pagani or Patek

Philippe watches or whatever it

is, or a Chanel bag or a dress.

They buy it because it's a

beautiful brand or they buy it

because it's a beautiful

proposition, but if they

actually know what's actually

going on, the enjoyment on the

product and the respect for the

product goes through the roof.

And once again, not so easy.

There's a reason why you, when

you buy a Pagani, there's an

engineer there and he's trying

to walk you through everything.

He's not doing it to sell you a

second car.

He's doing it so that you

actually understand and you can

appreciate and you can take

advantage of what that car has

to give you.

If you don't understand what's

happening here, you are not

going to reach the level of, of,

of, of pleasure and of, of

what's actually happening and

the reasons behind it.

And that's when we came up with

the idea of, well, let's make

ourselves available.

We don't know where this is

going to go.

I mean, it's going to be crazy.

It's it already is going crazy.

You know, these spaces are

filling out.

Reinhardt and I are going to

spend an enormous part of our

time, our personal time, our

professional time in speaking to

people individually.

That's not the most efficient

way of doing things.

It's a lot easier for me to get

on a podcast with you, you know,

go through it once broadcast to

whatever.

But it's not going to, in my

humble opinion, it's not going

to get across in the same way.

And it will touch a certain

amount of people who follow you,

but maybe not somebody else.

So let's open this up.

Let's open it up and let's walk

people through it.

And if they never buy a cigar

virus, fine.

That's not the point.

The point is, if you want to

elevate your experience, because

understanding something will

elevate your experience.

And if that's what I've

committed in my life to do is to

create what I believe is the

best tobacco in the world or

create what I believe to be the

best cigars in the world.

If that's my aspiration.

And it's also my responsibility

to share that with consumers.

Because Marifel is not about the

insanely beautiful packaging, or

Marifel is not about the

insanely, insanely beautiful

bands.

Marifel is about what's been put

together and how it's put

together and what it's supposed

to do, what it's supposed to

deliver as a proposition to the

consumer.

All right.

I got two small questions here.

Are you happy with where the

direction is going that you're

taking the family and the legacy

or do you have are you, are you

never satisfied?

How the fuck am I supposed to

answer that question?

I'm sorry for the language.

Oh, you're good.

I think what I'm happy about is

to see how excited and happy

consumers are with the products

and that the joy that that

brings us, you know, to, to

anybody in the company, whether

it's, you know, Melissa

Reinhardt, whether it's the

teams, you know, sitting in, in,

in, in Switzerland or in

Brussels or in Africa or

whatever it may be.

People are super happy.

People are, are excited people.

A lot of people recognize what's

going behind these products and

they're they're grateful and and

they express it and that brings

an enormous satisfaction to the

fight we're leading, gives a

reason to the fight we're

leaving.

But I'm of the nature obviously,

as now you're starting to know

me a little bit, never to be

completely content and always to

want to push things.

See, just going to have to deal

with that.

All right, that's fair.

That was a good enough answer.

All right, one final question,

and you said this, and I'm going

to try my best to get it right,

even though my writing is

chicken scratch.

Make sure you honor the people

you love while they're alive,

because when they're not there

anymore, it's too late.

Have you honored your father?

Never enough I.

Think that kind of answers the

last question for sure, man, I

can't thank you enough for doing

this with us.

This was a great podcast, great

interview.

It was great to really kind of

get to know you.

I mean, I went through and I

listened to a bunch of your

podcasts and I don't like to, I

want to know more about you.

I want to know more about your

family and the inner workings of

things.

And you really did provide that

opportunity for us today and I'm

very grateful for that.

So thank you so much for coming

out here and spending time with

us today.

I know that you're busy, man.

You got a lot to do, but you

still put time aside for the

people that are willing to put

in the effort with you.

So thank you very much.

I hate you.

I, you made me open up my heart

publicly, which I don't like to

do, but for some obscure reason

you managed to do that.

But I also want to thank you

because we are who we are for a

reason and we pursue what we

want to pursue for a reason.

And it's gentlemen like

yourselves that are able to ask

the right questions.

We're also able to understand

the answers.

And for that I appreciate it

very much.

Thank you so much again, man.

Appreciate it.

All right.

That's it, guys.

Show Notes

Personal and Up close with the Meerapfel Legend